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Posts posted by BackFromTheDebt

  1. Stop for a minute.


    Citi has an exemption for small claims courts.  

    I don't know jack about the CA courts, so I have no idea if a $7k debt would be in small claims or not.  I don't even know if CA has small claims.  

    If this is NOT small claims, the arbitration strategy may work.  If not, it won't.

    Since this appears to be a suit by a JDB, arbitration will probably work.  

    Either way, you should check out the threads on the California cases,  Apparently Cali is the state where it is easiest for the consumer to win a case. 


    Good luck!

  2. 3 hours ago, Ddjcplus4 said:

    As a matter of fact @BackFromTheDebt I am located in California. So at this point are there options for me to pursue? I want to  take care of this just not sure how to proceed. I’ve read so many things and hear bad things about H&H. Is this true or can i get a reasonable response from them. Thank you much!


    Well, cases are a lot easier for the debtor to win in California.   

    Unfortunately I have no knowledge of how to pursue a case in Cali.  

    Look up some of the California threads.  

  3. There have been a number of threads on this subject, although most were in the "other", now defunct, forum.  

    Yes, if you still have the bank account you used to pay them, they will know that bank account.

    Realize that things change very quickly.

    In the past, it used to be recommended that the debtor clear out his/her bank account before garnishment.  So, if a debtor's exam were scheduled, the advice (esp on the "other" forum) was to truthfully answer all questions, then as soon as you leave the exam clean out all accounts and put the money elsewhere.

    It was also advised that local banks were easier to find than non-local banks.  Some people would clear out of their local bank, and put the money in some internet based bank.

    Sometimes advice has been given to take out any excess money and spend it, such as pre-paying rent or mortgage for a while.  

    I mention this advice is old, and may or may not still be valid.

    Note that direct deposits and withdraws make this sort of strategy difficult.  Before clearing out the money, all those things would have to be dealt with.  

    There are other options, but be careful.  I know a guy who hid thousands of dollars in some old newspapers around the house.  His wife got fed up with nagging him about throwing away his old newspapers, and, ... I think you can guess the ending of this sad story.  I swear this really happened.  I know the family quite well.  

  4. 3 hours ago, BV80 said:


    From where are you getting the information leading to your questions?

    Perhaps from the Gold Fringe site.  


    That was for the old timers.  There were some threads in the old days about how using a gold fringe argument was the best way to lose a case big time.  

    Here are the facts, simple as A,B,C.

    A. Strange conspiracy theories travel the internet at the speed of light. (*)

    B. Some people believe these theories, even when told otherwise by folks with more knowledge.

    C. People who try out these weird theories in court often get slammed hard by judges.



    (*) Yes, I know the speed of electrons is actually slower than the speed of light, but the difference is undetectable to your web browser.

  5. On 3/21/2020 at 2:53 PM, nobk4me said:

    I wonder if this will benefit debtors.  Maybe safety in numbers?  More consumer protection laws?

    I can tell you a little bit about what happened after the financial meltdown a little over a decade ago --

    It helped in some situations, but not others.

    For example, at one point some courts were so swamped with foreclosures that some foreclosures were waiting many months, or even years, to be heard.  But eventually the backlog wore off.

    In some cases attorneys were so swamped they simply weren't filing cases.  I had one case sit in the drawer of a law office for a long time.  I sent in a DV with a demand for arbitration, and the lawyer left the firm.  Eventually the new attorney found the case just before SOL.  I did a preemptive arbitration to demand the Delaware SOL, and they eventually gave up the case right before the arbitration hearing.  

    Lesson -- the court proceedings will be delayed, but not stopped.  Some will get to live in their homes a while longer.  In a few cases, the SOL might pass on debts, in others the Delaware SOL might pass, so watch choice of law provisions.  


    Other examples -- many of the debt collectors were just swamped.  I had over $60k in various debts to a large American bank.  It kept bouncing around from CA to CA.  The bank was too busy for debt validation, so I played a game a whack-a-mole with DV letters.  That might have been due to bad records, see below.  

    In some cases, they got swamped and made careless mistakes that hurt their cases.  I won a few that way, even against a bank that NEVER loses, except to me.   

    Lesson -- careless, stupid mistakes are random events, and cannot necessarily be predicted.  I expect far fewer of them this time, since they learned a lot from last time.  However, look at the Midland/suicide thread to see that unbelievably stupid stuff still happens on rare occasions.  Stressed out situations may increase the number of stupid mistakes.  



    There are some two things that helped some of us enormously back in the old days, but the banks learned their lessons.  So don't count on this.

    Big change #1 -- bad records.  In the old days, some banks just had plain crappy records.  I won a case in court due to bad records, between $10-15k. I had other banks simply give up because of bad records. It is possible the American bank that walked away from over $60k did so because their records were really bad.

    One poster on CIC beat a foreclosure case because of bad records.  Kept his house.  

    My current job makes me one of the people insuring that this doesn't happen again.  Federal regulators are incredibly strict these days.  I know of cases where banks have spent millions of dollars to fix holes costing them thousands.  I even know of a recent case where a bank walked away from over $100 million because their records were bad.  I cannot tell you details, but I know this for a fact because I worked on the case.  

    Lesson -- do NOT count on the bank's records being bad.  These days they are almost always solid gold.  They rarely make mistakes, and they are very proactive about fixing the mistakes.


    Big change #2 -- arbitration.  In the old days, the arbitration landscape was changing month by month. It went from a total pro-bank scam to complete chaos to the weird system we have these days.  I was able to win some cases in the chaos period.  Also, I had some law firms give up cases just because I used the "A" word in my replies.  They avoided arbitration like the plague, until the figured it out.

    Lesson -- the banks and their lawyers know the system a lot better than you do these days.  It used to be the other way around.  When I was in my 3rd or 4th arbitration against lawyers who had never seen arbitration before, I had an advantage.  These days you are the newbie, and they are the professionals.  

  6. 10 minutes ago, Noreturn said:

    After both parties presented their case, the trial court ordered closing arguments be submitted in writing.

    Plaintiff filed their Closing Argument WITH Proposed Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law.

    Is it proper to respond to Plaintiffs facts and conclusions? Is it proper to object to fabrications?

    Is it proper to file proposed findings and conclusions without being ordered by the court?


    The answer to all the questions is yes

  7. 30 minutes ago, WhoCares1000 said:

    First off, we will tell you when something does not sound right and this did not sound right at first. That is why I said that if this is true, go talk to an attorney.

    As for getting what you want, you are going to have to sue to get them to state that you do not owe the debt because they want to be able to sell the debt down the line. Indeed, if they are suggesting that you commit suicide and are ignoring your letters, they have no intentions of stating what you want unless a court, or government regulatory agency, forces them do it so you will probably get some monetary settlement out of this. There, however, is nothing wrong with you donating any money you get to a worth while charity and you can even recommend in the settlement that a charity gets the monetary part of it.

    What you get from this board is the truth, even if it is not what you want to hear.

    More precisely, what you get from this board is as close to the truth as we can.

    Correct, nobody called the OP a liar.  

    I sometimes come over as less skeptical than most, because I feel it doesn't hurt me to assume what I am being told is the truth. If someone is making stuff up, well, no big deal.  At least people reading the forum might learn something.  

    There are certain things that happen on very rare occasions that are so weird they boggle the mind.  For example, over a decade ago, a collection agency broke federal law and put a nasty note in the mailbox of someone who posted here.  At our advice, this person sought out an attorney and got a settlement of a few thousand.  

    Only a few  were here back in the days of the Buffalo bully boys, when collection agencies, esp. those based in Buffalo, NY, used all sorts of unethical and bullying tactics.  Then-NY AG Andrew Cuomo shut down the Buffalo bully boys, and the combination of the CFPB and FDCPA law suits took care of most of the rest.  From personal experience, I can say it was not pleasant to deal with the Buffalo collection agencies.  

    It seemed a bit mind-boggling for Midland, a company that had been hammered hard by the CFPB and FDCPA lawsuits, to resort to this behavior.  Not just the one-off remark, but the constant bullying.  The experience of most people lately has been reasonably fair and polite behavior by Midland.  They really did seem to have mended their evil ways.  

    We can't fact check over the internet.  You make a statement, we can't tell if it is true, or slightly exaggerated, or completely made up, or a fantasy.  We have seen people who were not completely stable come in here.  We have also seen people who told tall tales that turned out to be true.  Actually, in some cases I WAS able to fact check over the internet.  At one point someone was kicked off this forum for bragging about fantastic results he was getting with an unproven tactic.  I was able to access his cases online, find out he was telling the truth, and I contacted him to learn the tactics, which I used even after I got kicked off this forum in my previous name for advocating arbitration.  

    All we can do is suggest the best plan assuming what you say is true.  And everyone one agreed that the best plan is for you to see a lawyer.  You have an appointment on Tuesday.  

  8. I am not that familiar with TN courts.  I have relatives in TN, and I think there has been at least one relative in the TN Bar for about 100 years or so.  Relatives have been involved in some of the most famous cases in TN  My family has been in what is now called Tennessee for longer than anyone can calculate.  

    Tennessee is a rather conservative place.  This is not like the Bronx, where juries hand out large verdicts.  That is a large part of why I was skeptical of a six figure settlement.  

    The OP has already scheduled a talk with a real member of the TN Bar.  The attorney’s opinion is probably more accurate than what any of us can predict.  

  9. 6 hours ago, Bashful-Nashville said:

    So now I have an appointment with an attorney on Tuesday. I plan to spend the rest of the weekend getting all of my paperwork in order. Because it’s more than just what she said. It’s all of it. The constant phone calls. Ignoring every letter I’ve sent. Basically tormenting me. I’ll take their money. Gladly. But given the choice of a huge payout for me or shutting them down - which I know would never happen - but given the choice - I’d shut them down. Because I can’t imagine what something like that could do to a person who already felt hopeless and helpless. At the end of the day - this is just a shitty person with a shitty job who feels shitty about herself. I can see that. But the fact that for a split second, she made me feel like ****... and well, that’s just... shitty. 😒

    Please keep us updated. This could be a very long process, but we want to know.  

  10. 1 hour ago, Bashful-Nashville said:

    I swear to you, I’m telling the truth.  It honestly embarrassed me at first. I don’t know why - I guess it was the fact that a complete stranger would think that I’m nobody and speak to me that way.  And then I got pissed!! The more I listened to it, the madder I got. I don’t do Facebook. I’m a pretty private person and drama isn’t really my thing.  But I had my brother-in-law look her up to see if she is a real person, using her real name - and yep. She is. Lives in Michigan. Has 11 friends. Looks pretty rough - my idea of a stereotypical debt collector who would just be a really hateful person.  Thing is - Midland may be on an upswing - and as a company I agree that they probably wouldn’t condone this. But they are responsible for their employees. And nobody will ever convince me that there aren’t super trashy people working for them. And this woman definitely is. 

    @Harry Seaward and I don’t disagree on strategy. 

    He is more optimistic, I am more cautious in my predictions.  That is all.  But even if my pessimism is correct, you are still looking at a payout. 

    You know what to do.  

    Do it. 

    I honestly hope Harry is right and I am wrong. 

    There is one way to find out.  Sue the b@statds.  See if you get the medium payout I predict or the large payout Harry predicts.  

    Sue them not just for yourself, but to stop this unconscionable abuse.  Sue them for those who are intimidated. 

  11. 1 hour ago, WhoCares1000 said:

    Like the medical industry regarding elective procedures and visits, they are simply going to reschedule for a time when business can return to normal. You still will have your hearing, just not as quickly. I would not sweat it too much because they cannot collect until they get a judgement and if you answered and filed a motion, they cannot get a judgement until the process plays out.

    That said, I think there are 2 instances where plaintiffs might be willing to low ball settlements. The first is where the defendant answered and the plaintiff is facing a huge time lag due the courts being closed, then the backlog of cases and mad rush to file new cases once the courts reopen. The 2nd is that judges might pressure plaintiffs and defendants to come to an agreement to clear out the backlog of cases.

    Expect a few unpredictable  things to happen because of overworked Banks,  debt collectors and attorneys as well.  

  12. 6 hours ago, Harry Seaward said:

    If this is for real, there's no doubt in my mind a jury would award a decently litigated case 6 figures. Juries have awarded 7 figures on FDCPA violations.


    You may be correct, if it ever gets to trial.  Or maybe not.  Maybe less.  I have no doubt the CFPB night slap Midland hard as well.  

    Thing is, neither of us have heard the recording, so we are just making completely wild guesses.    

    At this point the OP needs to find a good lawyer.  

    A good lawyer would listen to the recoding, get all the evidence the OP has, and make a somewhat more educated guess— only a guess because juries are unpredictable— as to what this case is worth. 

    And the particular location matters quite a bit.  The case would be worth far more in the Bronx, NY than in Enid, OK for example.  

    I agree this could be a decent payout.  I just don’t think counting unhatched chickens is productive.  

    Whether you or I are correct doesn’t really matter.  Both of us agree as to the OP’s next step.  Find a lawyer and push this. 

  13. 46 minutes ago, Harry Seaward said:

    Because, due to message boards like this one, they got sued so much that it started to cost them more money than the harassment was generating. Also, the CFPB cracked down on them with a hefty fine, and a warning that more would be coming if they didn't clean up their act. 

    There sure are. The vast majority of them, actually.  There is nothing shady or illegal about the debt buying industry in general. Midland is the largest and one of the most up and up of all of them. They buy hundreds of debt portfolios costing them tens of millions of dollars per year. Transactions at that level get a business noticed by several government agencies. Especially so when that business involves consumer finance.  They are being very closely watched.

    If what you're saying actually happened, and you had recorded proof, it would be a huge deal.  All you have to do is file your complaint with the CFPB and sit back to watch the fireworks. You'd have to sue them in federal court to get any monetary compensation, but, again, this would be a slam dunk with recorded proof. It could easily be a 6-figure judgment in your favor  

    This is why I suggested taking this to an attorney. 

    I have no idea if you could get six figures.  I am skeptical.  However, you could do a great deal of damage to Midland.  

    Here is the thing.  Federal regulators don’t mess around.  I have consulted  for companies where software errors led to regulators getting involved, because it meant the company was systematically violating regulations. One company wound up with a fine of over $10 million.  Another company ate a loss of over $100 million in debt forgiveness  because that was cheaper than whatever fine the regulators would throw on if they didn’t eat the loss.  Another company I consulted for was fined $1 billion, but that was for a truly spectacular mistake that cost lives and was on the front pages of newspapers for a long time.  

    Midland has regulators breathing down their necks already.  This could lead to a large fine. Or they could throw the employee under the bus, fire her, pay a small fine and a small payout to you   


    My guess is you are looking at low five figures personally, unless this actually gets to a jury trial when it could potentially be much higher.  But that could take years, and the judge could throw out a large verdict, etc.  

    I don’t have a clue what Midland will wind up paying you.  It is possible you could cause them some significant damage   

    So get a lawyer and get the opinion of someone who actually knows what the tape says. Random people on the internet can’t help you out any more   Get a pro and pounce   


  14. 1 hour ago, Don in Ohio said:

      Thank you very much for your efforts on my behalf. I called MCM @ 10:51,told them of my situation,and was put on "temporary hardship status",I wrote down the person's name I spoke with,he was gruff,but not too bad.

      He then gave me a second phone number to provide any documentation they may require,I also recorded the name of that lady,SHE was very pleasant,and after hearing my information,doing several security questions she assured me that the account was put on permanent hardship and that all collection activities will now cease.

    I asked her to please send me a verification of that statement and she assured me she would. I'm assuming she has to,based on the recorded conversation.

      I very much appreciate your advice and wish I could high five you. With much relief  ~Don

    I am happy things worked out for you.  Best of luck in these difficult times.  

  15. 2 hours ago, Don in Ohio said:

    I found the part where it mentions 'suspending' collection activites. Here is the actual quote "We suspend collection activities when a consumer demonstrates that he or she is experiencing significant financial hardship due to medical issues." I hope this will actually be dropped,and not just suspended. There is a part at beginning of website where it wants you to enter your MCM account number and last four. Should I enter this information?

       My reluctance stems from several things online about them being rude and predatory,and any information you give them will only worsen the situation..

    Midland is a big company.  Some of the people who work for Midland are complete jerks.  That is true.  However, some are not.

    Someone from this site in the past got Midland to drop a court case due to medical expense hardship.  

    If I were in your shoes, I wouldn't wait to be sued.  I would call Midland, and ask to talk to the people in the medical hardship division.  Those are different people from the debt collectors.  You are more likely to reach a real person.  


    I will be very blunt here.  You have a lifeline.  Don't throw away the lifeline because someone else at the same company allegedly acted like a jerk to someone you saw once post on the internet.  


    For example, one of my kids called me from the airport in tears because she was trying to fly home from college, having been given 72 hours to vacate her dorm, and someone at the airline was going to charge her $100 because her suitcase was a few pounds too heavy.  I told her to get into another line.  She did, and the ticket counter attendant was very nice, saw she had been crying, and let her slide for the few extra pounds.  The moral:  if you get a jerk, try again with someone who isn't a jerk,

  16. Midland has a policy 

    If you are in bad financial shape because of medical reasons, they will drop the case.  At least one poster has had debt forgiveness this way, possibly more.  

    Look up the Midland web site.  Find the policy on the web site.  Then contact Midland and ask what documents you need to get the debt forgiveness.  

    Good luck and best of health to you. 

    • Like 1

  17. 1 hour ago, Don in Ohio said:

       We  received a 'Pre-Legal Notification' today,delivered by UPS,2nd day air. The amount listed is $932.65,they want bi-monthly payments of $25.

      They state if they don't hear from us or receive a payment "MCM may proceed with forwarding this account to an attorney"

      Original creditor is Comenity Bank,on behalf of Lane Bryant, MCM Inc. is current owner/servicer of the account. We live in Ohio,they have the default date listed as 6/6/19.

    The debt is my wife's,and I do my very best to pay all of our debts,or keep them in good standing,however; she was diagnosed with a rare disease first week of June '19,and her neurologist has had her off work ever since. I'm on SSDI for a destroyed back,so our ONLY income is the disability I receive once a month.

     As you may imagine this has been very taxing to receive this notice,on top of all the every day things to worry about. My wife and her health is my number one concern,she's had 2 cancers,and now this ultra rare brain disorder.

      If there is some sort of "what to do now" advice,I would greatly appreciate it. Let me know if there is any other information needed from me. Respectfully, Don

    Who, exactly, is MCM?  Is this Midland?  

    This information is crucial.  

  18. 3 hours ago, Michelleb8 said:

    Hi I received a letter in the mail today that they will send this to a lawyer if I don’t pay $50 a month. This was after I talked to them on the phone and told him that I couldn’t afford it right now bc I lost my full time job and I was only working part time making $10 an hour with a max of 18 hours a week. I’m a single mom of 2 have to make rent, electricity, gas and other necessities. Obviously they don’t care. So my question is what can I do? Now I’m not working with this Coronavirus. I have the weight of the world on my shoulders and I don’t know what to do with them. He was rude on the phone and threatened me that he was going to sue me. I did say do it! I don’t have anything! Last payment was 12/24/2018 balance $2,676.96 which I feel like 676 is interest. Thanks



    And that is how they want you to feel.  

    We need more info to help you. 

    1.  Who was the original creditor?

    2. Who owns the debt now?

    3. Who is contacting you?

    4. What state are you in?