Andyt293 Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 Just spent an hour trying to find a post that addresses this situation but had no luck.Here it is in a nutshell.Cell phone company failed to provide proper service so they were cancelled. Then they racked up early termination charges, late fees et cetera. Told them to go pound sand. Last payment made in Feb 2000. Phone company sold account to junk debt buyer June 2004. JDB posted my CR as dated opened April 2004, date reported June 2004. JDB assigned account to CA. Sent DV letters to both JDB and CA. SOL in my state is 4 years. CA agency has sent this account back to JDB.JDB answered my letter and acknowledged my letter and informed me that their policy requires that I send them copies of my drivers license, ss card and my signature on a blank piece of paper JDB also informed me that their investigation may take as long as 90 days. In the meantime, they are currently reporting this to all three CRA's.Now there is no way I am going to give them copies of anything, let alone my signature on a blank piece of paper. Getting to the reason for my search tonight. What is the law on attempting to collect a time-barred debt? If the JDB is not allowed to collect on a debt that is out of the SOL, then do I have a FDCPA violation here in that they reported this account on my CR's as a form of collection activity? Their CA did not report anything, just sent a letter or two.Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyt293 Posted December 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 anyone? bueller? bueller? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willingtocope Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 Don't have an answer, but here's some questions.1. Are you sure account is SOL? Contracts for services are different than credit card accounts (I think) in some states...2. If it is SOL, what state are you in? For example, in California its a felony to attempt to collect a time-barred debt.3. If you're not in Calif. and it is SOL, have you collector a C&D pointing out its time-barred? CA can continue to try to collect on SOL debts...its just they can't win in court...supposedly...if the judge knows the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gprncss Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 In the meantime, they are currently reporting this to all three CRA'sIs the account listed as "account in dispute reported by subscriber'? If not that is a violation!Have you also tried disputing this account with the CRAs. From what I know a company cannot/should not validate to a CRA if in validation, doing so is another violation. Hope this help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyt293 Posted December 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 In my state the SOL for any debt is 4 years. This debt was out of the SOL by least three months when it was purchased by the JDB. I have disputed this with the three CRA's. Looking for something that I can hold over the JDB so I can get them to drop the matter immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willingtocope Posted December 8, 2004 Report Share Posted December 8, 2004 What's on you CR and SOL are not related. Things can stay on your CR for 7 yrs + 180 days. And, a CA can continue to try to collect on SOL debts (except in California).Therefore, if the CA is on your CR, then as long as its listed as "in dispute", I don't think you can do anything to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyt293 Posted December 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 I guess my original gripe was that it was not reported on my CR by the original creditor, but instead by the JDB after the SOL had expired. "Dated opened" is April 2004 and "date reported" is June 2004. No mention of date of last activity on my online CR's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willingtocope Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Maybe you do have something to smack the JDB with. If they've got the dates wrong, then they're violating the FCRA. Do a search on how to deal with that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdouglaslee Posted December 9, 2004 Report Share Posted December 9, 2004 Well, no one knows where you are so help is limited. There are several issues with SOL. In some states, the SOL actually extinguishes the debt. Because the debt is extinguished, it cannot be collected in court, or at all and an attempt to collect violates the FDCPA. If it doesn't specifically state in your state's statutes that the rights are extinguished, then you will have to search through your state's case law to see if it has been argued that way. I can tell you that in Ohio, the SOL does not extinguish the debt, but you might be able to make an argument that it does because the SOL for other tort actions extinguishes all rights. As far as an FDCPA violation, it depends on what state your in because of different appellate court rulings. It may be a violation to attempt to collect and/or to threaten to sue and/or to actually sue, but that depends on where you are. JDB answered my letter and acknowledged my letter and informed me that their policy requires that I send them copies of my drivers license, ss card and my signature on a blank piece of paper JDB also informed me that their investigation may take as long as 90 days. In the meantime, they are currently reporting this to all three CRA's. This is very clever. "Their policy" well, unfortunately for you, that doesn't violate the FDCPA as a false/misleading statement or misrepresentation. Unfortunately for them, the FDCPA has precedence over their internal company policies. Here's what you do. Write a brief letter acknowledging their letter and the date you received it. Inform them that you have no intention of complying with their policy and that you are not legally obligated to do so.Now that you have ticked them off, let them know that the letter constitutes prima facie evidence of continued collection activities violating 15 USC 1692g(. Advise them that within fourteen (14) days of receipt of this letter they will nullify the debt, delete the trade-line and remit to you via Western Union, let's say $3,500, since that's probably in the ball park for the non-refundable retainer fee for an attorney admitted to the federal bar in your city just to look at the complaint you would be filing. Attach a copy of their letter to your response/ITS and send it off. If they do not provide validation within, oh, 60 days, disptue again with the CRAs then sue for failing to validate and failing to cease collection plus reporting violations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyt293 Posted December 10, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2004 I am in PA. I should mention that the letter (asking for DL, SS and signature) I received was in response to a phone call I made to them after being informed that the their CA was no longer handling the matter and had turned it back to the JDB. I had originally DV'd both the JDB (who is listed on my CR) and the JDB's CA. I sent both letters on the 7th and the JDB signed for it on the 10th. Well guess what I received today. A letter dated on the 26th and mailed on the 2nd of December informing me that they (JDB) have received my letter dated on the 7th and that they received it on the 16th (green card signed on the 10th). The letter goes on to say "please be advised that XXX purchased the above referenced account from AAAA in June of 2004. We have since placed this account with BBBB. Please contact them for any information you require with regard to this debt. They can be reached at XXX-XXX-XXXX."I am going to wait until the 10th of this month and send them ITS incorporating much of GDL's idea's. I will fax them copies of their conflicting letters. Thanks so much!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aLT bug Posted December 20, 2004 Report Share Posted December 20, 2004 What's on you CR and SOL are not related. Things can stay on your CR for 7 yrs + 180 days. And, a CA can continue to try to collect on SOL debts (except in California). Therefore, if the CA is on your CR, then as long as its listed as "in dispute", I don't think you can do anything to them.Can you elaborate to the reason or point me in the direction to why CA can not continuously pursue after the SOL in California? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willingtocope Posted December 20, 2004 Report Share Posted December 20, 2004 Do a search using the "search" button at the top. I think it was Methuse that posted the reference to the fact that its a felony to try to collect on a time barred debt in California. Personally, I was unable to find anything using google that said that...although there is a specific law against reporting time barred debts in Wisconsin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aLT bug Posted December 20, 2004 Report Share Posted December 20, 2004 Do a search using the "search" button at the top. I think it was Methuse that posted the reference to the fact that its a felony to try to collect on a time barred debt in California. Personally, I was unable to find anything using google that said that...although there is a specific law against reporting time barred debts in Wisconsin.I found it.. California Civil Code Section 1785. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retmar Posted December 20, 2004 Report Share Posted December 20, 2004 There is some confusion here.California says that it is a violation to even attempt collection of a timebarred debt. BUT, a CA can send dunning letters for eternity. The only requirement is that the letters cannot threaten in any fashion, such as pay or else. Also, one could pursue for harassment if the letters become too frequent, such as weekly. This is in reference to FDCPA 807(2)(A) for Federal and CCC 1788.17 for State.CCC 1785 only refers to reporting. CCC 1788 is the Rosenthal FDCPA and the one you would use to nail CA's violating California Law.As to the Felony issue. CPC 517-528 covers Fraud and Extortion. When read, it can be determined as being true, but, none of us have yet to find case law to back this up. Also, it is said they would only charge IF a Civil Suit was filed. Until this is determined to be fact, I would be cautious when threatening a CA. Yes, I do believe it to be true and have threatened in the past, but, now I am having second thoughts due to so many CA's becoming "educated" on our tactics. Therefore, if one decides to "inform" a CA, I would use the verbiage "In some States, it could be considered Fraud and/or Extortion to continue collection activity on a timebarred debt", or words to that effect. At the same time, when one receives a collection letter, whether first or 10th, for a timebarred debt in California, I would respond immediately with a full C&D telling them to close, delete, and go eat Maggot Droppings, or be sued, as well as referred to the State AG. This will usually stop all further contact. As to the initial question of this thread, I back gdouglaslee totally as to the next step. At the same time, as gprncss noted, get the violations going. Remember, your main goal is to get this resolved to your benefit only, not theirs or anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts