New here...need some advice!

[jntmom]

Just wanted to start out by saying this site is GREAT! I have found so much useful info here!

Here is my situation, any advice would really, really be appreciated.

My DH and I bought a Chevy Blazer back in 2001. About 18 months into owning the SUV, as my husband was driving, the back axle broke in half and the tires flew off. The car then proceeded to SLIDE about 3/4 of a mile down a hill. In hindsight, I realize this was the wrong thing to do, but we got a flat bed tow truck and towed the Blazer back to where we bought it and dropped it off. (spoke to a lawyer about this who said we should have kept it and fought the insurance company...hindsight is always 20/20 four years later).

Anyway, when the credit company started calling me, they told us that if we paid 600.00 a month for 18 months, they would accept that as payment in full. At the time, I had just had our second child and we just could not afford that! (the day the Blazer broke, we had to go and get ourselves another car...with higher payments). I told the credit agency that we would pay 200.00 per month until the debt was paid. We were told that they would not accept that, and that if the check we sent was anything less than 600.00it would be returned to us. Of course, we again could not afford that, so we paid nothing.

Now, years later, they are suing me (oddly, just me, not my husband even though both of our names were on the Blazer). We owe 11,500 remaining. I was told (by the law firm that is representing the car company) that they would accept 500.00 per month for two years, or a settlement amount in one lump sum (they did not give me a settlement amount). I was told if we sent in anything less than 500.00, they would not send my check back, but they would still proceed with the judgment. I really do not want a judgment against me, as it will RUIN my credit (not like it's not already ruined). We are thinking about just sending them a letter with what we can afford in one lump sum to take care of this.

I went to see a lawyer today to discuss this (I have 20 days to respond to the judgment paperwork). He basically said to try to settle or send in a judgment note to see if they would accept it.

What amount is usually a good amount to start with for a settlement??? Do they normally accept it???

I would really, really appreciate any advice anyone has!!!!!

[LadynRed]

So, the blazer broke in 2003. It is about a year from the SOL.

When they sold the SUV at auction, did you get notices BEFORE the sale that told you when and where the sale would take place ?? Did you get ANY notices AFTER the sale of how much it sold for at auction plus an itemized statement of the sale and all added fees ??

If not, then under the UCC they may not have any right to the deficiency at all. Under UCC they MUST follow ALL the steps and rules. If they do not, the SOL drops to TWO years and they forfeit the right to the deficiency.

[jntmom]

Actually I never received anything (before or after the sale) That was something the lawyer asked me as well. I told him I did not receive anything but he never went any further with that.

Here is the only problem. How do you go about PROVING that you did not receive anything? They could easily say they sent it just as I can say that I did not receive it!

One thing I did forget to ask the lawyer this morning regarding the SOL. When does the time actually start from???

Thank you SO MUCH for answering my post. I was getting ready to send in a letter for settlement tomorrow with this lawyer, now I'm wondering if I should wait!!!

[FloridaDebtor]

Actually I never received anything (before or after the sale) That was something the lawyer asked me as well. I told him I did not receive anything but he never went any further with that.

Here is the only problem. How do you go about PROVING that you did not receive anything? They could easily say they sent it just as I can say that I did not receive it!

One thing I did forget to ask the lawyer this morning regarding the SOL. When does the time actually start from???

Thank you SO MUCH for answering my post. I was getting ready to send in a letter for settlement tomorrow with this lawyer, now I'm wondering if I should wait!!!

i would imagine that they need to show proof as in ceritified return receipt for proof they sent you anything....and the sol starts with the first missed payment.

[jntmom]

I wanted to get something out to the laywer today. Is there some place to look up the SOL for PA so I can reference that in my letter? Do I just say that I want proof that something was sent to me (before and after) before I will agree to a settlement (is that how I would word that).

Sorry for all the questions, I just want this taken care of so I can stop worrying!!!!

[jntmom]

So, the blazer broke in 2003. It is about a year from the SOL.

When they sold the SUV at auction, did you get notices BEFORE the sale that told you when and where the sale would take place ?? Did you get ANY notices AFTER the sale of how much it sold for at auction plus an itemized statement of the sale and all added fees ??

If not, then under the UCC they may not have any right to the deficiency at all. Under UCC they MUST follow ALL the steps and rules. If they do not, the SOL drops to TWO years and they forfeit the right to the deficiency.

Is this written somewhere??? I have been looking everywhere to find this!

[suki]

Hi JNTMOM,

I was not sure what UCC was until I looked it up on Google.com . This is a good site and Ladyinred was trying to point out that when an auto auction is done they may have already recovered the lost money from you from the auction sale. You need to find out if they sent a “before and after” notice of this transaction sale of this Blazer.

You said you had 20 days to respond so take this time to double check everything before you land into another mess like the one that started all this mess. Take one step at a time before you make any final decisions.

Your state’s General Attorney’s office also can assist you with getting more info as to getting the auction info and what the policy is to notify you of the auction sales transaction of your Blazer in PA.

Check this out it has a lot of info on what the UCC does in terms of legal auto auctions.

http://www.nfa.org/Collateral.aspx

Here is another goodie thought you might want to read this as well…

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/lemon/lemon.htm

Good luck and hopes this helps!

Suki

[jntmom]

I just spoke with the lawyer (if that even what he is) that is listed as successor to Household Auto. I told them that I wanted documentation that I received the before/after sale papers. I was just told that the account was sold to them and they do not have them. Now what?????

[jntmom]

Hi JNTMOM,

I was not sure what UCC was until I looked it up on Google.com . This is a good site and Ladyinred was trying to point out that when an auto auction is done they may have already recovered the lost money from you from the auction sale. You need to find out if they sent a “before and after” notice of this transaction sale of this Blazer.

You said you had 20 days to respond so take this time to double check everything before you land into another mess like the one that started all this mess. Take one step at a time before you make any final decisions.

Your state’s General Attorney’s office also can assist you with getting more info as to getting the auction info and what the policy is to notify you of the auction sales transaction of your Blazer in PA.

Check this out it has a lot of info on what the UCC does in terms of legal auto auctions.

http://www.nfa.org/Collateral.aspx

Here is another goodie thought you might want to read this as well…

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/lemon/lemon.htm

Good luck and hopes this helps!

Suki

Thanks for all the good info!!! It's funny, I tried to call the Attorney General's office twice today (consumer affairs department). Both times they transferred me to Penn Dot which is all driver's information (registrations, drivers permits). UGH. I feel like I'm hitting my head against a wall! LOL

I know for sure they did not get their money!!! We owed 12,000 yet on the blazer and when the tires flew off, it RUINED everything under the car.

I'm going to try and get another consultation with a lawyer JUST to find out if this whole before/after sale paperwork requirement still applies to me since we dropped the car off. I cannot seem to get a straight answer (and dont understand what I'm reading half the time LOL)

[E. Normis Debtor]

Not sure about PA, but a couple of things should be considered.

Just because you dropped the vehicle off, does not necessarily give them right of possession. There are specific actions a creditor must take in order to enforce such a right.

Likely when you defaulted on your payments you would need to have been provided a notice of your right to cure the default. Absent that, they cannot pursue a deficiency judgment.

They would also need to obtain and execute a writ of possession (or whatever it's called in PA) which they may not have done since they already had the vehicle. If they had no lawful right to possess the vehicle, they had no lawful right to auction it.

[jntmom]

Since it is pretty obvious from my numerous posts...I dont have a CLUE about the law. The more I read, the more confused I become LOL.

Would it be better just to go back to another lawyer for another opinion???

(Yesterday's lawyer just told me to settle or make sure I take everything out of my name if I have a judgment put on me)

[suki]

Hi JNTMOM,

you are very welcome!

QUOTE:Thanks for all the good info!!! It's funny, I tried to call the Attorney General's office twice today (consumer affairs department). Both times they transferred me to Penn Dot which is all driver's information (registrations, drivers permits). UGH. I feel like I'm hitting my head against a wall! LOL: QUOTE

They may have tried to send you there to get info on the car, which now I am thinking you may want to find out where this car went... I wonder what would happen if you ordered a carfax history of the Blazer. All you need is the VIN number...it might show how the car's trail path and history went...?

Anyone know more about CARFAX history and would it show where it was auctioned off and how much ?

Hope this helps a bit!

Take care.

Suki

[LadynRed]

What you need to look up is the UCC (uniform commercial code) for PA. SOL in PA is 4 years, but if they didn't send the proper required paperwork as I stated, they forfeit their right to a deficiency.

You might want to call this PA lawyer, he's a consumer protection attorney:

http://pennlawyer.com/

UCC Article 9 -

§ 9-611. NOTIFICATION BEFORE DISPOSITION OF COLLATERAL. (a) ["Notification date."]

In this section, "notification date" means the earlier of the date on which:

(1) a secured party sends to the debtor and any secondary obligor an authenticated notification of disposition; or

(2) the debtor and any secondary obligor waive the right to notification.

( [Notification of disposition required.]

Except as otherwise provided in subsection (d), a secured party that disposes of collateral under Section 9-610 shall send to the persons specified in subsection © a reasonable authenticated notification of disposition.

© [Persons to be notified.]

To comply with subsection (, the secured party shall send an authenticated notification of disposition to:

(1) the debtor;

(2) any secondary obligor; and

(3) if the collateral is other than consumer goods:

(A) any other person from which the secured party has received, before the notification date, an authenticated notification of a claim of an interest in the collateral;

( any other secured party or lienholder that, 10 days before the notification date, held a security interest in or other lien on the collateral perfected by the filing of a financing statement that:

(i) identified the collateral;

(ii) was indexed under the debtor's name as of that date; and

(iii) was filed in the office in which to file a financing statement against the debtor covering the collateral as of that date; and

© any other secured party that, 10 days before the notification date, held a security interest in the collateral perfected by compliance with a statute, regulation, or treaty described in Section 9-311(a).

(e) [Compliance with subsection ©(3)(.]

A secured party complies with the requirement for notification prescribed by subsection ©(3)( if:

(1) not later than 20 days or earlier than 30 days before the notification date, the secured party requests, in a commercially reasonable manner, information concerning financing statements indexed under the debtor's name in the office indicated in subsection ©(3)(; and

(2) before the notification date, the secured party:

(A) did not receive a response to the request for information; or

( received a response to the request for information and sent an authenticated notification of disposition to each secured party or other lienholder named in that response whose financing statement covered the collateral.

§ 9-626. ACTION IN WHICH DEFICIENCY OR SURPLUS IS IN ISSUE.

(a) [Applicable rules if amount of deficiency or surplus in issue.]

In an action arising from a transaction, other than a consumer transaction, in which the amount of a deficiency or surplus is in issue, the following rules apply:

(1) A secured party need not prove compliance with the provisions of this part relating to collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance unless the debtor or a secondary obligor places the secured party's compliance in issue.

(2) If the secured party's compliance is placed in issue, the secured party has the burden of establishing that the collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance was conducted in accordance with this part.

(3) Except as otherwise provided in Section 9-628, if a secured party fails to prove that the collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance was conducted in accordance with the provisions of this part relating to collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance, the liability of a debtor or a secondary obligor for a deficiency is limited to an amount by which the sum of the secured obligation, expenses, and attorney's fees exceeds the greater of:

(A) the proceeds of the collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance; or

( the amount of proceeds that would have been realized had the noncomplying secured party proceeded in accordance with the provisions of this part relating to collection, enforcement, disposition, or acceptance.

(4) For purposes of paragraph (3)(, the amount of proceeds that would have been realized is equal to the sum of the secured obligation, expenses, and attorney's fees unless the secured party proves that the amount is less than that sum.

(5) If a deficiency or surplus is calculated under Section 9-615(f), the debtor or obligor has the burden of establishing that the amount of proceeds of the disposition is significantly below the range of prices that a complying disposition to a person other than the secured party, a person related to the secured party, or a secondary obligor would have brought.

[jntmom]

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU. I spent three hours trying to find this yesterday!!!!!! LOLOL. Just my luck, PA only has limited codes online, and, of course, they do not have #9

[LadynRed]

I know, I looked there first, only a small portion of it is on-line.

All states have adopted the UCC, some made minor modifications to some parts. An attorney should be able to look up the PA differences.