reaging discrepancy

[prettykitty]

pls help i really need clarification?

i have a CA that aged off of EXP in Oct 2007, same CA updated with TU in Oct 2007, but will age off TU Dec 2007, I'm unsure about how it's rpt'g to EQ.

my question is about how it shows on EQ & when it will age off?

Date rpt'd 10/2007

DOLA 1/2001 this should mean tl aging off 2007?

DOFMD 9/2007 what does this mean?

info. i've read from threads:

1) DOFMD (Date of First Major Delinquency) is the date you initially went delinquent and then never again brought it current. There could still potentially be payments after that

if this answer is true then they are re-aging, because i never paid anything on this acct in 2007, or maybe 2001 i don't know what this acct is for, i just didn't bother since EXP aged it off.

2) "The Date the 1st Major Delinquency Was Reported" to EQ by the OC. NOT the Date of (your) First Delinquency.

does this mean that DOFMD just means when the CA actually rpt'd it to the CRA?

a very good thread on reaging info. http://debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263138&highlight=date+1st+major+delinquency+reported&page=2

http://www.carreonandassociates.com/articles/reportingtime.htm

[MadMonkey]

I think one of the mis-understood things is how people read there CR.

However, let's start with the basics.

Any negative trade line will fall off at (7) years, + up to an additional 180 days.

The date of first deliquency is the date you made your last payment, that brought the account current. If you make a partial payment your still deliguent for that month because you did not meet the terms on the minimal payment requirment. If you continue to make partial payments, your deliquency refelects back to when you first made a partial payment, or missed a payment completely.

So if you had a Visa card and you made your last payment on Dec of 2000 and the statement in January of 2001 shows your check posted on 12/10/2000. Then your clock started ticking on 12/10/2000.

CRA do not create tradelines they only report what others report to them about you.

Using my example. The Visa went deliquent on 12/10/2000 and no one reported it until 12/10/2003. There is nothing wrong with this. Its perfectly legal for them to report the TradeLine anytime in the seven year period. However on that Tradeline there must be a reference as to when it will drop off and the Date of Last Activity. The drop of date will be one of the two:

a. Exactly seven years from the Date of First Major Deliquency, (ie: Your last payment in the example 12/10/2000.

b. Seven years plus up to an additional 180 days from the Date of First Major Deliquency.

In the example the TL would fall off 12/31/2007 and or up 6/31/2008.

This is were the record keeping saves your Bottom.

In my example: You have your CC statement for Jan, 2001 and shows the payment for Dec 10, 2000. You have a bank statement that shows the check clearing your bank a few days later. Maybe you even have a copy of the cancelled check. These are the items your going to need to dispute.

Your first course of action is to verify the date that the TL is going to drop off.

--------------------

My personal experience was Crap1. The trade line always showed a drop off date of 12/2005, however starting around 2002 Crap1 would update the account every month. By the time the thing actually dropped off, that one TL for Crap1 took up one whole page because of the constant updates. However the drop off date always stayed the same. There little present to me to keep my credit scores from improving.

What people fail to understand is that as long as your in the 7+180 day zone they have the right to report monthly that your late. That's not re-ageing the debt that's only reporting that at the end of that month you still owed $$$. Crap1 is notorious for this, and there is nothing you can do about it except hammer the CRA with DV letters every month. You might get lucky and they pull it off, but with Crap1 it most likely will pop up again. I tried over and over and could not get that thing to come off.

----------------------

Your report should show a date of last activity. Thats the starting date you work with on figuring out when its going to drop off. All the other stuff is meaningless. Now if your looking at your report one day and the date of last activity jumps up a year or two, that's reaging your account. At that point you know have to demand proof that you actually made a new payment too them, and in some cases this is were a lawyer is needed. The burdon of proof lies on them, not you, expecially if you have good record keeping.

Some more info. When a CA takes the account, again using my example above.

Visa charges off the account in 2001 and the debt sits in there portfolio and its sold in 2002 to NCO on 5/1/2002. NCO reports it on the CRA's on 5/1/2002.

That TL lists NCO and the original creditor Visa. There are two columns you need to pay addition too.

One is the one named: first reported on

and the second is named: Item as Date Reported

These had better have different dates.

The column named First reported on, had better be the first date of major delig. to Visa in the example 12/10/2000.

The other column, Item as Date Reported should read 5/1/2002. That's the date NCO reported it. If Column First Reported on reflects the date 5/1/2002, that's re-aging the account.

Also the TL has to reflect who the original Creditor was. I had several CA only list themselves. That's a big bozo no-no. I easily had them removed by sending a GPSL to the CRA that simply said I don't know who these people are, I have never done business with them, they are trying to collect money from me, which I consider extortion. The CRA contacts the CA to verify that I in deed actually have debtor relationship with them. There answer has to be no. My debtor relationship by Fed Law is to the Original Creditor and not the CA. If they came back and said they were Creditor, I would have had them on violations.

Special Note: It is imperative that you get paper copies of your reports, and not ones you down load. I learned early on that what you pay for and download or access online from the Big 3 when your disputing things does not look anything like what you get from them in the mail.

Online serves the purpose of starting the process, after that you go paper and mail, no exceptions.

Hope this helps you get a better understanding.

[Textoy]

The EQ reports I have only list a field of Date Major Delinquency First Reported: under the Accounts Information section. The way thats worded, it would represent the date they first reported the DOFD which may/may not represent DOFD. As far as Date of Last Payment (DOLP), may/may not represent DOFD. If you missed the Jan, Feb, and Mar payments, made a Apr payment and then never made a payment from then on, then the DOLP would be Apr but the DOFD would have been JAN. When a JDB buy a debt and then assume the identity of a OC. They then use CA to collect the debt. Even so, the real DOFD for a given account tracks back to the original OC for all of them. You talk about CA info but you never indicated what the original OC account info was.

[Ahntara]

"...date of first delinquency is the date you made the last payment..."

DOFD is the date the account becomes LATE after you made the last payment. It's usually 30 days later. It begins the countdown of Reporting Period and, in most states, is the 'cause of action' for SOL lawsuits.

Most CR's don't list the DOFD. You have to contact the CRA's directly and request this.

[MadMonkey]

"...date of first delinquency is the date you made the last payment..."

DOFD is the date the account becomes LATE after you made the last payment. It's usually 30 days later. It begins the countdown of Reporting Period and, in most states, is the 'cause of action' for SOL lawsuits.

Most CR's don't list the DOFD. You have to contact the CRA's directly and request this.

I have to differ with you on the DOFD. Attorneys I have spoken too over the years have told me the clock starts ticking the day/month they post your last payment to the account.

I use my own experience. Every one of my neg. TL's showed and dropped offed exactly seven years from the last month I made my final payment.

Regarding the CR's and DOFD.. For yucks I looked at my old reports from 2005/2006.

EQ called it : Date of last activity.

EXP called it: Date of Status/Last Reported

TU: Max. deliquenty of 90+ days occured in (date)

These are reports that I got in the mail. I looked at my downloaded ones and they did not list the detailed information that the mailed ones did.

Maybe things have changed.

[faircreditgirl]

Hi all and it's nice that there is a forum where people help each other. I had a couple of issues that i would love resolved. I really didnot understand the reaging thing. But on my EQ report, I have a CA on it what can

i do to have it deleted?

BTW what is a GSPL? Thx

[MadMonkey]

Hi all and it's nice that there is a forum where people help each other. I had a couple of issues that i would love resolved. I really didnot understand the reaging thing. But on my EQ report, I have a CA on it what can

i do to have it deleted?

BTW what is a GSPL? Thx

Start by reading the Sticky's at the top of this forum, and use the search button.

[prettykitty]

mm: Using my example. The Visa went delinquent on 12/10/2000 and no one reported it until 12/10/2003. There is nothing wrong with this. Its perfectly legal for them to report the TradeLine anytime in the seven year period. However on that Tradeline there must be a reference as to when it will drop off and the Date of Last Activity. The drop of date will be one of the two:

a. Exactly seven years from the Date of First Major Deliquency, (ie: Your last payment in the example 12/10/2000.

b. Seven years plus up to an additional 180 days from the Date of First Major Deliquency.

In the example the TL would fall off 12/31/2007 and or up 6/31/2008.

This is were the record keeping saves your Bottom.

pk: i don't have any records of this acct. i didn't bother because it aged off EXP 10-2007, TU in 12-2007, i was trying to figure out when it will age off EQ.

mm:Your first course of action is to verify the date that the TL is going to drop off.

pk: b4 my credit journey i was the worst record keeping, bill paying person, of the century. i'm basically using my CRA rpts to verify DOLA's here, i know it's dropping soon from EQ just not sure when.

mm:Your report should show a date of last activity. Thats the starting date you work with on figuring out when its going to drop off. All the other stuff is meaningless.

pk: bingo mm this answers my q, i'm going to just go by the DOLA.

mm:Also the TL has to reflect who the original Creditor was. I had several CA only list themselves. That's a big bozo no-no. I easily had them removed by sending a GPSL to the CRA that simply said I don't know who these people are, I have never done business with them, they are trying to collect money from me, which I consider extortion. The CRA contacts the CA to verify that I in deed actually have debtor relationship with them. There answer has to be no. My debtor relationship by Fed Law is to the Original Creditor and not the CA. If they came back and said they were Creditor, I would have had them on violations.

pk: this is a very good tactic, without the word "extortion", do you think this would be a good tactic to use against the NCO neg tl on my rpts? NCO shows assigned 4/2007, but GC made an inq on my rpt 10/2007 & sent me a dunning, BUT NCO updated on all my rpts 11/2007. Can they both attempt to collect on the same acct? I already DV'd GC for that dunning. do u think that strategy will work to get GC off?

mm:Special Note: It is imperative that you get paper copies of your reports, and not ones you down load. I learned early on that what you pay for and download or access online from the Big 3 when your disputing things does not look anything like what you get from them in the mail.

pk: i have all my rpt's in paper.

thanx for your feedback, you actually went above & beyond answering my q, you guys all gave great advice, i printed this page:mrgreen:

[prettykitty]

Textoy 11-18-2007 07:23 PM

________________________________________

The EQ reports I have only list a field of Date Major Delinquency First Reported: under the Accounts Information section. The way thats worded, it would represent the date they first reported the DOFD which may/may not represent DOFD. As far as Date of Last Payment (DOLP), may/may not represent DOFD. If you missed the Jan, Feb, and Mar payments, made a Apr payment and then never made a payment from then on, then the DOLP would be Apr but the DOFD would have been JAN. When a JDB buy a debt and then assume the identity of a OC. They then use CA to collect the debt. Even so, the real DOFD for a given account tracks back to the original OC for all of them. You talk about CA info but you never indicated what the original OC account info was.

Pk: you are so RIGHT! i had to read it again and the key word in Date Major Delinquency First is "Reported". on my EQ it rarely list my DOLP. unfortunately, i don't have a OC listing on my rpts or any records of this acct., i'm just going by the DOLA on this one.

[Textoy]

I just posted a DOFD example thread

http://debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com/forums/showthread.php?t=277688

You cannot assume DOLA represents DOFD. If you mis payments in April, May, and June, make a regular payment in July, then miss all payments from August on, the DOLA would be July but DOFD would be April.

[oracle-4]

I have to differ with you on the DOFD. Attorneys I have spoken too over the years have told me the clock starts ticking the day/month they post your last payment to the account.

The clock may be ticking, but I don' think it is registering.

It would not begin to register until the account actually went delinquent.

Lets assume that the account balance is $1000 as of July 2007 as per the July bill. I make a payment of $100. The balance is then $900. I make no charges in August. The August bill is $900 plus the interest and carry charges, say $915. I don't make an August payment, nor do I make a September or October payment. The account is now 3 months in arrears.

The account goes delinquent when I fail to make the August payment, because that is when, in fact, the account became delinquent, not when I made the last payment. In this case, DOLP would be July 2007, DOFD would be August 2007, or whatever date was that the August payment was actually due.

If I make a $15 payment in November 2007, I do not repair the delinquency (in most states) but the DOLP is now reset to the date November 2007. The DOFD remains August 2007 and will remain so until I bring the account current. (Current is normally defined as all delinquent payments made along with all associated late charges and fees paid.)

I would suggest that the attorneys that you were speaking to had not done the accounting logic necessary to come to the correct conclusion.

As long as the account is not delinquent, there can be no DOFD. Unless the account is made current (however your state may define a reaffirmation) the DOFD doesn't change.

[prettykitty]

tt:You cannot assume DOLA represents DOFD. If you mis payments in April, May, and June, make a regular payment in July, then miss all payments from August on, the DOLA would be July but DOFD would be April.

this is for a phone bill not a cc, i don't think phone bill payments work like cc's where you can skip months & pay some later. i've never had a cc, but for phone bills they will disconnect your service, & i've never paid after a service interruption on anything. I've only ever paid 1 CA ever for WFS & i regret that. i'm blind to this bill, i don't remember paying anything on this bill, i don't the #, if it's cell or land line. i added a fraud alert to my rpts, but this could very well be my bill that i just don't remember i was very young, & irresponsible in 2001. i read the threads on AFNI's reputation, so i didn't bother DV'ng them as the acct is old & it already aged off EX, next is TU in 12/07, hopefully it will age off EQ some time soon(praying).

ok i'm gonna read ur thread now...

[oracle-4]

... i don't think phone bill payments work like cc's where you can skip months & pay some later....

Phone bill, CC bill, mortgage, whatever. It is when it goes DELINQUENT and never brought current that defines DOFD, irrespective of subsequent payments. Date of last payment is always DOLP.

[Ahntara]

"...Attorney I have spoken too..."

The plain language in the statute is clear.

"...The account goes delinquent when I fail to make...payment..." The FCRA provides a formula for determining (the beginning of) Reporting Period in 1981c, Subsection 605©. It's the first delinquency immediately preceding collection or charge off, not the last payment.

This date is not published in most CR formats. By reading 1681s-2, subsection 623 we KNOW that Data Furnishers must supply this date to the CRA's within 90 days of supplying the TL info. The CRA's have the month/year, it's just not on most CR's. You must contact them for this specific date.

Activity, as in DOLA, can be anything; the charge off action, payment made after default, transfer to CA. Consumers cannot use DOLA to determine RP. Same thing with 'Date of Status'. "Date Last Reported' is simply the month/year the DF last provided info to the CRA's about the TL. This can be a routine procedure, in response to the consumer's dispute, which is a request for investigation, or in response to payment.

"...i don't think phone bill payments work like cc's..."

Utility service accounts don't ordinarily allow for 6 mos of late payments prior to collection or charge off. They are not credit accounts either, but payments for service. The issue is DEFAULT. The first month/year an account becomes delinquent immediately prior to default is the DOFD and begins RP.

[prettykitty]

thanx a million Ahntara!!!

Utility service accounts don't ordinarily allow for 6 mos of late payments prior to collection or charge off. They are not credit accounts either, but payments for service. The issue is DEFAULT. The first month/year an account becomes delinquent immediately prior to default is the DOFD and begins RP.

although a vet bill is not a "utility" service, would this same standard apply? if the date of vet visit/service 6/04 when would the rptng end? 2011 i'm assuming? i'm really trying to find out when it will be out of the 4 year CA SOL. i use the drop off date to figure this out.

[Textoy]

If the vet visit was in 6/04 and the first payment was due in 7/04 then,

7/04 plus 4 years SOL period would = 7/08

7/04 plus 7 years plus 6 months for CR drop off would = 1/2012

[prettykitty]

thanx TT! the vet's CA has went bananas with upcharges. i will dispute 7/08 when it's out of SOL.

[Textoy]

BTW, you indicate states as NV and CA. You then quote CA SOL. If your living in NV the NV SOL applies. If you live in CA the CA SOL applies. While it is true that the FDCPA allows the collector to pick the state, to enforce a judgement, it has to be brought within the state you reside. Costs the collector to much $ to transfer a judgement from state to state so they almost always bring suit in the state you reside. Just make sure your using the SOL for where you reside.

[prettykitty]

legally a CA resident, i'm attending school in NV, but i'm transferring back to Cali beginning of this year...i don't have any utility bills, drivers license, or ID card here. i actually pay out-of-state school fees.

[Textoy]

Hmm, sneaky. Your working your CR using a NV mailing address (as a fine upstanding student) as a CA resident. Your legal I think but the CAs may get a bit confussed! ROFL

[prettykitty]

technically if i pay out-of-state fee's i'm not a resident...i'll be home soon though8]

[prettykitty]

haven't tested this ltr & unsure of it's practicality, but i wanted to post it here for future ref.

YOU

address

Dumb CRA

address

Date

Re:File #

To Whom It May Concern:

This is a formal request for information contained in my credit file. Per the FRCA, � 609. Disclosures to consumers [15 U.S.C. � 1681g], I am entitled to all information contained in my credit file. The FTC�s opinion is that a consumer should also have access to any archives a CRA may keep; FTC Staff Opinion Letter Cohan (08-01-00). Please furnish me with all information you have under my name and/or Social Security Number.

I am particularly interested in the date of first delinquency, as reported by the furnisher of information, for the following accounts:

OC

Acct. #

CA

Acct. #

I respectfully request this information be furnished within 15 days upon receipt of this notice. Your failure to comply with the law set forth by the FCRA may result in the involvement of my legal counsel.

Best regards,

YOU

Certified Mail

Cc: FTC