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Dave Ramsey--The Way to Go ! ! !

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Per Visa and MasterCard (Corporate organizations); they do offer the same protection as Visa or MasterCard credit cards and any issuing bank that refuses to meet those requirements are in violation of their agreements with Visa/MasterCard (and likely in violation of a lot of banking and consumer laws as well).

Like anything else, we have to be willing to take them to task if need be.

Like I said, been there and done that and they DO NOT offer the same protection. And there is a huge difference in playing with your cash and playing with your credit. Took me months to straighten out an unauthorized debit on my debit card. A day on my credit card. Oh but that is just me, if I were you, I am sure it wouldn't be a problem.

The difference between a debit and a credit card? If you have to take either to task, you're likely still have your cash avaialbe if you were using a credit card.

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Per Visa and MasterCard (Corporate organizations); they do offer the same protection as Visa or MasterCard credit cards and any issuing bank that refuses to meet those requirements are in violation of their agreements with Visa/MasterCard (and likely in violation of a lot of banking and consumer laws as well).

Like anything else, we have to be willing to take them to task if need be.

Per Federal law, credit users' obligation is capped at $50. Debit users: $500. Additionally, "zero liability" on debit cards do no cover certain transactions such as ATM transactions and some PIN purchases.

-r

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When I was in Spain, the ATM machine at the train station in Granada kept my debit card due to a malfunction. What do you think I did in that situation and what would you have suggested I do?

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Like I said, been there and done that and they DO NOT offer the same protection. And there is a huge difference in playing with your cash and playing with your credit. Took me months to straighten out an unauthorized debit on my debit card. A day on my credit card. Oh but that is just me, if I were you, I am sure it wouldn't be a problem.

The difference between a debit and a credit card? If you have to take either to task, you're likely still have your cash avaialbe if you were using a credit card.

If you've got a bank that refuses to live up to its agreements change banks.

Better yet, change banks and then sue them.

As I said; you've got to be willing to take them to task when the screw you; if you let them get away with it then who is really at fault?

And what was said in jest IS actually true; if you have six months of living expenses in the bank you don't get all that excited about a mistake on a debit card. But when a mistake happens, and they will happen, and it isn't taken care of in a reasonable amount of time I'd let them explain why to my attorney and a judge.

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And seriously I would love a solution to my car insurance issue. If there is a way I can drive in Philly without paying for car insurance (which is based on my credit) that would be phenomenal. What is your suggestion?

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Per Federal law, credit users' obligation is capped at $50. Debit users: $500. Additionally, "zero liability" on debit cards do no cover certain transactions such as ATM transactions and some PIN purchases.

-r

I believe those limits on debit cards are if used as a debit card...if it's processed as a credit card the credit card limits apply. I never use my pin number...ever.

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The difference between a debit and a credit card? If you have to take either to task, you're likely still have your cash avaialbe if you were using a credit card.

There are other advantages too. For example, if you use your credit card wisely, it's a free 30 day loan. If you use your debit card, you lost 30 days worth of interest. Also, some merchants "block" your funds. If you rent a car with a debit card for example, they may "block" hundreds of dollars of your funds as a deposit. They never actually get your money, but you lose access to it until they take the block off. And then the potential fees if you miscalculate...

-r

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When I was in Spain, the ATM machine at the train station in Granada kept my debit card due to a malfunction. What do you think I did in that situation and what would you have suggested I do?

I have no idea what you did! :)

I don't think I'd ever try to use an ATM outside of the states (I'd go to a bank and take a cash adavance if I needed more cash than I had on hand) but if that did happen to me I guess I'd call Visa or MC to start with.

That said, I always travel with enough emergency cash (in the form of traveler's checks) to handle an emergency like that.

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I have no idea what you did! :)

I don't think I'd ever try to use an ATM outside of the states (I'd go to a bank and take a cash adavance if I needed more cash that I had) but if that did happen to me I guess I'd call Visa or MC to start with.

That said, I always travel with enough emergency cash (in the form of traveler's checks) to handle an emergency like that.

Yeah, but there is no Commerce Bank branch in Europe, so going to a bank and getting a cash advance really isn't possible.

Taking cash is a huge risk, and near impossible to exchange. Traveler's checks are also near impossible to exchange anymore, and when you finally find a place the fees are so astronomical that it just adds to the frustration.

I always use my debit card in Europe at an ATM machine. It's the easiest, and far less expensive, way to get cash. On occasion though things happen (strip becomes demagnetized, machine eats it, etc). Nice to have a back-up.

I had to rely on credit cards for the rest of that trip. I always have two on hand when I'm overseas in case something happens. If I didn't have them with me, I'd probably still be there, 3 years later...

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Yeah, but there is no Commerce Bank branch in Europe, so going to a bank and getting a cash advance really isn't possible.

Taking cash is a huge risk, and near impossible to exchange. Traveler's checks are also near impossible to exchange anymore, and when you finally find a place the fees are so astronomical that it just adds to the frustration.

I always use my debit card in Europe at an ATM machine. It's the easiest, and far less expensive, way to get cash. On occasion though things happen (strip becomes demagnetized, machine eats it, etc). Nice to have a back-up.

I had to rely on credit cards for the rest of that trip. I always have two on hand when I'm overseas in case something happens. If I didn't have them with me, I'd probably still be there, 3 years later...

Yep. I used my ATM card in Europe and in Mexico, for the same reason. Lack of Commerce Banks there. Have I mentioned that I love Commerce??

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I got this one Robert.

If you're going to fly, just save up enough to buy your own plane. I mean, if you have to rent a seat on the plane, then you can't afford to fly.

Then save enough to buy a hotel in Europe.

Eddie

Eddie,

That is the hardest I've laughed since I've been on this site. GREAT answer !! Is there a mod here??? Give the man a green box....whatever they are.

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Nobody will ever agree on who is correct and who is not.

If we learn about money and learn at a young age the difference in credit and debt then everyone will be better off.

When your young, just graduated high school and getting out on your own their no way to survive without credit. It not a matter of not getting that 50 inch plamsa TV it's about survival at that point in time.

You need a car to get to work, insurance, gas and other incidentals to get there. Even apartments need a credit check so you can move in.

So how can a 19 year old survive?

I fully understand the reasoning behind what is being said, but you have to come down to the real world and actuall see what is happening.

As for utilities, the deposit or lack of, depends on your credit situation. Same with insurance, no matter the deductable.

I used to read the magizine "Money" and other magazines like that. Every article when money was made, the person already had money. As I suspect in this case.

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Chucksnee,

That's a very nice, and diplomatic answer. I think more 19 year olds should have that early a grasp on this subject. I suspect that with you it may be the Army experience that has grounded you. Go Army.

It won't work with Robert, but I'm sure the rest here will agree with you.

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Chucksnee,

That's a very nice, and diplomatic answer. I think more 19 year olds should have that early a grasp on this subject. I suspect that with you it may be the Army experience that has grounded you. Go Army.

It won't work with Robert, but I'm sure the rest here will agree with you.

Thank you, i'm here for a reason also. I screwed up in my younger life and have been paying for it. IF I would have been TAUGHT about what credit and debt is, way back in 1988, I would be in a different position now. Not that im in a bad situation now, but it would be different.

Oh, your Army have we got something for you! Just come inside...

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Thank you, i'm here for a reason also. I screwed up in my younger life and have been paying for it. IF I would have been TAUGHT about what credit and debt is, way back in 1988, I would be in a different position now. Not that im in a bad situation now, but it would be different.

Oh, your Army have we got something for you! Just come inside...

Perhaps the case with all of us. For me it was a single event, a DWI in 2000, that because of what I do had to defend it vigorously. I hired the best lawyer I could find and told him "at any cost". Long battle and cost a small fortune. I was embarrased by it and it really wiped me out financially at the time (sorry Robert, didn't have my 6 month fund at the time:)) I held out best I could and started to let accounts go. Held some, but couldn't keep up.

I would never have told anyone, and this is the first I've ever said this "out loud" I could easily have gone to my folks for the money, called the creditors, done any one of a million things that would have been better than what I did. Nothing at all. Ignored it. Looking back I'm mad at myself for not just dealing with it.

So, you're right, if I'd had a clue back then that I could have negotiated with the OC's, or not had so much pride that I'd not even tell my family.........

On the brighter side though, I wouldn't have "met" such good people and feel we're all in the same boat to one degree or another. My purgatory is nearly over by the time I learned what I've learned here. I'm envious of those that kept their heads out of the sand and simply dealt with it like so many here are.

No idea what this means? "Oh, your Army have we got something for you! Just come inside"

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No idea what this means? "Oh, your Army have we got something for you! Just come inside"

Sorry, I ment to say this is how easy it is to get credit while in the Army.

Once they know your Army, they know they will get your money...

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Perhaps the case with all of us. For me it was a single event, a DWI in 2000...

Ha ya' stinking drunk!....

Just kidding ;). But heck dude, we all do stupid things in life. Welcome to the club! Thankfully, this financial stuff is reversible.

-r

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I just wanted to chime in on the Dave Ramsey thing.

I have been following his plan (probably about 90%) for the past 18 months, and it has made a big difference.

We are down to owing on 3 credit cards and 2 cars, and those will all be paid off by next Christmas (assuming nothing horrible happens.)

I think the biggest differences for us have been:

1. We budget our money now. We made (and still make) good money, but were blowing 110% of it. Now we actually have money left at the end of the month.

2. We are teaching our kids about money and credit. They save 50% of all money they get and give 10% away (to whatever they want). They are getting a far better education that my wife and I ever did about money.

We also bent his rules a little in that I still put 1% into my 401k and I already have a 3 month emergency fund.

We made our mistakes and my kids will make theirs. Hopefully by using his 'baby steps' and teaching our kids what he taught us, they will be able to handle them better.

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We also bent his rules a little in that I still put 1% into my 401k and I already have a 3 month emergency fund.
How's that contrary to his rules? (I've only listened to his show a handful of times)
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How's that contrary to his rules? (I've only listened to his show a handful of times)

I should have stopped my 401k entirely to pay off my debt and the biggere emergency fund is not supposed to come along until after the cars and credit cards are paid off.

Since I make good money, I did a sort of 'hybrid' approach. The thing I was really lacking was discipline and a budget to keep me on track. Once I had those 2, I was still able to follow his plan and bend it just a bit to fit my desires.

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I should have stopped my 401k entirely to pay off my debt and the biggere emergency fund is not supposed to come along until after the cars and credit cards are paid off.

.

That's a joke, right? This guy is so off in his ways of saving money.

To NOT contribute to a 401k is absurd, regardless of how much debt you have. Worst case you take a loan from the 401k (which you pay back to yourself, including the interest - yes you pay taxes if you leave your job before paying it, but still odds are you benefit). It's free money in most cases, and it grows at a decent rate. AND it's a pre-tax contribution. :evil:

He also says to pay off the smallest credit cards first, then work your way up to the larger balances, snowballing the payments. That's more expensive in the end than if you pay the higher interest cards first.

I'm sure he came up with these rules so he would find his little niche in the financial guru world, but his logic is just so off. I really don't get it at all.

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Wow. That's insane that he'd recommend that a person should stop contributing to their 401k. The tax deferment advantages and the fact that it's bulletproof from creditors alone should make it a priority. You'll really appreciate the miracle of compound interest when you discover that the Social Security Administration doesn't have the means to support you in your old age. Skipping just one year of contributions can have a huge affect on your retirement savings.

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I'm still blown away by the 401k thing. Last year I contributed so much that I actually ended up with a tax refund for the first time in years.

I wonder what Suze thinks of Dave. xpopcornx

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