SGB2112 Posted January 1, 2009 Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 From the 'Plantiffs response to defendant's production of documentation request'.I wrote: "Itemized statements or credit card statements from account number #### that demonstrates how the alleged amount of xxxx was calculated."JDB: ' Objection. Request is overly broad and not in compliance with the rule requiring specific requests. TEX.R.CIV.P.193, comment 2. Subject to and without waiver if stated objection, see attached and will supplement.'I wrote:" Any and all further documents beyond what was previously requested, that clearly establishes the defendants liability and/or responsibility to the alleged debt.JDB: Same objection as above.Yes it is my account. They have sent me an old statement & signature showing this is my account, but what am I supposed to do?Trust the JDB? I have researched them on the net and they are bottom of the barrel snakes. If they can provide those documents, why not what I requested? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazjeepcj7 Posted January 1, 2009 Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 What are you trying to accomplish by chasing additional paper on this account? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGB2112 Posted January 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 The amount owned and how it was calculated because I have recieved a few settlement letters with varying amounts listed as to what the original debt amount is. To properly negiotiate a settlement, the real amount owned is of critical importance IMHO. That is why I want to see how it was calculated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swirlgirl Posted January 1, 2009 Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 Do you really not remember how much you owe? Do you remember the original credit limit? Assuming you maxed that out, everything over that amount would be interest and fees. You can think of a settlement amount based on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGB2112 Posted January 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 I have a hard time trusting the this JDB on anything. -they screwed up getting my address correct. -they have called third parties AFTER I got served.-The amounts listed as owed, including ALL FEES(their words, in writing, not mine) have varied in the HUNDREDS of dollars.I do have a hearing in small claims court in a few weeks & I will be damned if negiotiate a settlement based on their varying numbers. Thanks all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazjeepcj7 Posted January 1, 2009 Report Share Posted January 1, 2009 You should have the amount from the original creditors statement that the plaintiff furnished you. You do have a right to an accounting of any amounts added to the amount due the original creditor. You might want to look at the usuary laws in your state and case law on allowable legal fees... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry1018 Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Hello, it is basic contract law that the plaintiff be able to itemize the accounting for the entire balance being sued for with plenty of case law to back it up. And as for settling, why would you think of settling until they have proven their chain of custody?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGB2112 Posted January 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 If it is basic contract law, why would they refuse to provide this information? Regarding Chain of Custody..Plantiff is "Capital One (USA) NA" followed by the name of the JDB..does this mean Cap One hired them..the JDB bought it..and what is the 'NA' mean? Non Appliciable? WTF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTO429 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 File a motion to compel discovery, the judge can order them to provide what you want if it is done correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazjeepcj7 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 NA - North AmericaYou need to find out if the account still belongs to Capital One. If the original creditor owns the account you are less likely to prevail in a court of law...If you are trying to determine the interest, legal and collection costs added to the debt why not submit interrogatory questions asking for each item, including how each item was calculated and the authority for each item to be added to the account total... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notagain Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 It appears that SGB is on discovery now.I'm in similar situation. If you can discover that the JDB is the real party in interest, or that there is no chain of custody, this could be useful.If you want to roll over, you could use the amount in the statement they sent you.Otherwise, I agree that any judge should recognize the fact that a fair accounting of the demanded amount must be made. It would be crazy for collectors to not have to prove what they are looking for. Don't give them an inch on this one.notagain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notagain Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Just found this under 'Forms' sticky:4. Plaintiff has failed to provide a detailed list of the debts to the Defendant in the initial debt collection notice as require by the FDCPA and as evidence by case law. Coppola v. Arrow Financial Services, 302CV577, 2002 WL 32173704(D.Conn., Oct. 29, 2002) – Information relating to the purchase of a bad debt is not proprietary or burdensome. Debtor must phrase their request clearly to obtain: The source of a debt and the amount a bad debt buyer paid for plaintiff’s debt, how amount sought was calculated, where in issue a list of reports to credit bureaus, and documents conferring authority on defendant to collect debt.Hope it helps!notagain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGB2112 Posted January 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I looked up something on the 7th Circuit Court..Fields vs Wilbur Law Firm..they found that "failure to itemize the amount of the debt, including the amount of attorney fee's was deceptive and violates the FDCPA".And "It is unfair to consumers under the FDCPA to hide the character of the debt, thereby imparing their ability to knowlegeably assess the validity of the debt.One simple way to comply with 1692e and 1692f would be to itemize the various charges that comprise the total debt." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notagain Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I looked up something on the 7th Circuit Court..Fields vs Wilbur Law Firm..they found that "failure to itemize the amount of the debt, including the amount of attorney fee's was deceptive and violates the FDCPA".And "It is unfair to consumers under the FDCPA to hide the character of the debt, thereby imparing their ability to knowlegeably assess the validity of the debt.One simple way to comply with 1692e and 1692f would be to itemize the various charges that comprise the total debt."Looks good!Just remember, FDCPA applies to 3rd party JDBs, and not OCs, so just make sure you are prepared for that. Coppola v Arrow doesn't seem to limit the scope to FDCPA.notagain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGB2112 Posted January 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I lost & I won in a small way.Observations:1. Hearing set for 9:00am..judge shows up at 10:30.2. One lawyer represents all the JDB's & OC's.3. 90% settle with her before going to trail.4. I see the offer & decline.5. 90% of those not taking the offer go up to the judge..and say they are broke, would pay if they could, etc. 100% lose. Sniviling, whining cowards imho. No legal defense. Nothing.MY CASE.Plaintiff asks me to verify: Yes it is my account, yes it is my signature, yes those are my last 4 digits of SS. Plaintiff asks for xyz $$$.1. I list 3 violations of the FDCPA, 1692f ,16923e & illegal 3rd party call.2. Judge, Plaintiff, I guess the court reporter seem a bit taken back?3. Give everyone a copy of 7th cicuit ruling and read relative parts to my case. Also read Coppola vs Arrow & another local ruling pretty much the same. Read Plaintiffs objection to my request for itemization.4. I ask judge to compel discovery since my requesting itemization was denied in the Plaintiffs response.5. Plaintiff says she is trying to find more statements.6. Judge to me: This is small claims court not 7th district court..different jurisdiction blah blah blah. That is your signature? Last 4? Anything else to add.7. Yes, plaintiff has violated FDCA since day 1 by calling third parties..8. Plaintiff: JUST ONCE YOUR HONOR(Need to get court transcripts!). We apologized and never made the same mistake.9. Plaintiff has admitted to violating the FDCPA on record your honor..I would like a reduction in the amount owed..10 Judge. That is another case. Rule in favor of Plaintiff..you can appeal if you want etc.The good: Plaintiff is on record about violating the FDCPA & clearly admits it. Must look into ALL OPTIONS on this one.The bad: I lost.The good. The deal offered on the phone today is better than what was offered by the plaintiff right before trail.The bad: Watched a couple of more people. Guy with lawyer lost too. EVERYONE LOST or settled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notagain Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Great going, nice war story!Your judge sounds like a complete idiot with no respect whatsoever for your rights. I can't believe the judge didn't give you a fair accounting.This judge is working for the credit card companies, no doubt. I think the jurisdiction crap is a BS excuse. It's U.S. case law, not foreign law you were citing. I mean, that's crazy. You telling me that all case law you bring to that judge has to be from the Texas court system? Basically, the judge is saying he has no respect for FDCPA whatsoever. 'It doesn't apply in my courtroom'. I wonder if you could complain to the Texas Bar. At any rate, I bet you could get your case law to stick on an appeal.Anyway, you certainly gave the judge pause. You admit the debt is yours, and only want a fair accounting, is what it boils to. Any judge should respect that...Great job. I'm curious what would be involved in appealing it. You can tell they DO NOT HAVE RECORDS. This will be very problematic for them if you go forward. And you have a clean shot at them on FDCPA. Awesome! If you want to settle, tell them you're ready to appeal. But, you are willing to take the amount on the statement minus the FDCPA violations.You can have some fun with it! Congrats. Keep us updated, for sure.notagain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry1018 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 "we're trying to find more statements"-- Isn't that grounds for a continuance at best??? Three componants of a contract-- Offer, acceptance, and consideration. The judge should have required them to itemize what they say you owe.I hope you appeal-- good luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Small claims is the cheapest way to go, but civil court is the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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