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trueq

Jams is dead for "debt collection arbitration"

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JAMS representative in testimony about JAMS practices on 9/29/09: (mega thanks to jetzer6 for posting this!)

Jay Welsh: No. I just wanted to make sure that -- one of the reasons I wanted to be here is so

that the broad brush wouldn't be too broad. JAMS doesn't do debt-collection arbitrations. Never

has. And although I've been getting a lot of calls lately from banks asking if we would be willing

to do it, my response is that it's like asking somebody who doesn't drink whether you're gonna start

drinking. [ Laughter ] But we have had consumer protection since the mid-, late-'90s where in

consumer cases, one of the requirements is that consumers don't pay. They just pay what they

would pay if they filed in court. They don't pay the arbitrator's fees in consumer arbitrations as that

is defined. So the cost of the arbitrator -- and I believe even NAF, everything was paid by the

company. I don't think that's a reason in these kinds of debt-collection cases.

****TRANSLATION: EVEN JAMS WILL NOT TAKE DEBT COLLECTION CASE FROM CREDIT CARD****

ARBITRATION IS A COMPLETE DEAD END FOR DEBT CLAIM. I DON'T SEE ANY DOWNSIDE IN FORCING ARBITRATION NOW THAT ALL 3 PLAYERS ARE "OUT" ON AN OFFICIAL BASIS.

NOTE: CREDIT CARD COMPANIES ARE SCREAMING AT JAMS TO TAKE CASES. CREDIT CARD COMPANIES KNOW THEIR LITIGATION RIGHTS ARE SCREWED WHEN CONSUMER EXERCISES ARBITRATION CLAUSE!

Trueq's book:

1.) Pull arbitration card. Screw card out of court.

2.) File huge claim in JAMS against credit card for deceptive practices/collection violations.

3.) You have no fear of JAMS claim for debt collection against you. If JAMS does allow claim, pull out this testimony and remind them "JAMS doesn't do these claims."

Edited by trueq

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I wouldn't necessarily call it testimony - it was a roundtable discussion.

Of course, how can you file a JAMS claim on credit arbitration if the card company can't force it back on you?

Something seems odd here, but I'm not in any sort of place to research arbitration law.

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If JAMS were to accept debt collection claims from a credit card bank against a consumer....

It certainly would be a deceptive trade practice, a violation of my state's consumer law and a potential violation of FDCPA!

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Trueq , I hope you can help me with this , With their complaint they attached a credit card agreement , it contains 2 separate Arbitration Clause's , one includes the statement ,------------"we will pay the filing fees and other arbitration fees above the cost of filing in that Small Claims Court " ------------ the other -----------------------" we will pay the filing fees and other arbitration fees "

In my MOTION TO DISMISS I claimed they had fabricated the Agreement ( they Did ) part is from a Juniper Bank agreement and the other part is from a Barclays Bank agreement . They both list AAA and NAF , no other choices .

Juniper Bank sold out to Barclays Bank before the time of the alleged Juniper Card ( so maybe they bought the rights to the name also )

In my case CONSOLIDATED ASSET MANAGEMENT I,LLC bought the debt from Sagres Company who bought the alleged debt from Barclays Bank .

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you will need to "withdraw" your fabricated agreement defense.

Acknowledge the cardholder agreement (which means you need a copy) and exercise the arbitration clause.

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So now....what's the best course of action for those of us who were considering requesting arbitration with JAMS for Cap1 account? Is this just going to amount to a "stand-off" between the consumer (who is requesting arbitration per card agreement) and bank (who can now say, well there are no more arbitration forums, so that point is moot)?

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Trueq , the way the case stands now is the Judge said to call to set hearing , I checked and there is no time limit so I will just not set hearing . I had gave Plaintiff my Discovery demand the 24th and I received their discovery demand yesterday so I have about 10 days lead time . If they don't respond in their 30 days I will move to dismiss , if they do respond I will demand my Arbitration rights .

I think I am okay on this case .

Let us know if you learn more about any changes with JAMS , I do need a better understanding on the step by step process after the letter to exercise the arbitration clause.

Am I responsible for contacting and setting up the Arbitration ?

How much time am I allowed to do what I have to do ?

Can I just sit back and wait until the Plaintiff gets tired of waiting and then react ?

Then when I hear from Arbitration again sit back and wait till they again get tired of waiting and so on and so on ?

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Just because Cap1 designates arbitration forums that are unavailable, DOES NOT NEGATE THE ARBITRATION CLAUSE!

Cap1's litigation rights are still waived!

Its not your problem Cap1 is stupid in relation to its contract language (granted, events of last 6 months worked against them!).

Standoff is good!

You win standoff!

The only recourse is for Cap1 to petition the court to strike its own arbitration clause!

Can you say "awkward".

I can't scream it loud enough...exercise the arbitration clause and forum under Cap1 contract...you will put them in a box nearly impossible to get out of!

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I am thinking of doing this with my Cap 1 case. What are the risks? Also, I have several counterclaims under the FCDPA in my answer. (I already have my answer/counterclaims on file, but this case is at the pre-discovery stage).

Can I still use my counterclaims in arbitration? I was confused by that from all the reading I have done so far in here on arbitration.

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I'm going to call on Friday and get a hearing for motion to compel. Hopefully plaintiff's attorney doesn't know JAMS is dead. We are going to fight this and win. They should have taken the settlement we offered them, which was about 85 percent of what they asked. Screw them now.

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OH and one defense a consumer could use against Credit Card company in court if they try to strike their own arbitration court, (this would probably only work in informal courts such as Illinois and with reasonable judges) is "Your Honor, they brought us to court to enforce their contract, the very contract they say we broke, and now they want to break their own contract? That doesn't seem reasonable nor ethical at all."

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you could just assert their claims to arbitration....at that point you have done the damage to their claims.

Cap1 MAY force your counterclaim to arbitration, in that case just file it with JAMS.

Either way JAMS will refuse to hear their claim----at least according to JAMS chief legal counsel!

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This is an interesting thread.

Somebody please correct me here if I'm wrong. But this also seems to be a great way to screw a JDB's case as well. Not just for an OC who is suing.

We have seen many cases where a JDB has exercised the arbitration clause against consumers before the downfall of the NAF. So if a JDB, out of stupidity, produced the terms of agreement (with the clause) and was able to prove that this was the original agreement through an affidavit from the OC, then a consumer can also exercise the clause which would totally screw their case. Right?

If that is the case, the JDB most likely would try to wiggle their way out of it by 1) attempting to strike the clause which they would then be in breach of contract since they purchased the debt, or 2) attempting to prove that they now have the wrong terms of agreement which *could* put them into a potential perjury situation—providing all documents were authenticated by the OC.

Either way though, I have yet to see a JDB prove a case with authenticated documents from an OC. But if it *did* happen and the consumer exercised the arbitration clause against the JDB and their case, it would cause a major headache for a JDB.

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JDB, as an assignee, has to abide by the contract.

Arbitration has changed over the last 4 months!

You can screw the JDB out of court too!

The key is: If they try to motion the judge to appoint an alternate arbitrator make sure you drag out the FAA that the FAA DOE NOT ALLOW HIM TO APPOINT AN ALTERNATE ARBITRATION FORUM.

These credit card contracts are about the arbitration forum, not just arbitrator.

If you cut that off (9 times of 10, JDB will not even be smart enough to argue the point), they are left with getting you to agree to an alternate. (which you are NOT required to do, and gives you leverage to possibly force them to PAY YOU!).

OR

ASKING THE JUDGE TO STRIKE THEIR OWN ARBITRATION CLAUSE.

That is very problematic from a legal standpoint. (Judge we screwed ourselves with this clause, can you strike it so we can recover this claim in court?)

It would be like asking court permission to shoot yourself in the head.

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