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Need help writing DV


Linda7
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Here's a new twist!

I'd like to come up with a DV letter to send, but am kind of toying with the idea of things I'd like in it.

This one in particular would be for Asset . . ., but if we could come up with a good letter - anyone disabled or elderly might be able to use it! :rolleyes:

They have sent a collection letter with the offer of a settlement, but there is nothing there saying they have 30 days to dispute the debt. Why - I have not a clue!

I'm going to ask for things like the authenticated cardmember agreement, complete payment history from a zero balance up to the amount of the alleged debt (hopefully this would make sense of the "balance"), credit card statements verifying account number and account holder and authenticated evidence of the agreement or sale of the alleged debt between the original creditor and Asset.

I know that they don't "have to" produce these items - but, in order for her to be able to validate the debt - she "needs" these items as she doesn't recognize the debt.

Now the plot thickens - I'd like to incorporate the fact of possible arbitration into this letter as well and as a conclusion, I'm thinking about letting them know that even "if" this comes back as hers, she has no assets since her accident and permanent disability and the only income she draws is social security disability which cannot be garnished.

They should be able to tell from her credit report that she hasn't even had a mortgage since the sell of her house after the accident years ago when the disability began.

Should she also send a bank statement with account number blacked out to prove this or maybe a copy of her disability report to prove her status? I don't really expect them to believe this unless we prove it in some way - although in looking at the credit report, looks like they'd understand that something went haywire several years ago!

I've heard where some others have let them know beforehand and it stopped the collection process. It's just sad to see the worry. They may come knocking, but there is nothing for them to collect on this one!

Any thoughts or somebody want to tackle the letter? xdancex

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Step on is to send the DV and retain rights under the FDCPA. If the letter doesn't have the language of you have 30 days to dispute, this may not be the first letter. Working with the elderly she may have already spoken to them on the phone and agreed the debt was valid.

Given that write the DV letter with as much depth as you desire, as you know they only have to send back what is required by law. This draws a line in the sand for collectors violations.

As far as arbitration a simple statement in the DV letter- If the alleged agreement has any arbitration clause that waives your litigation rights over this alleged debt, I hereby elect it.

Once this is done see what response you get, and start keeping track of violations, in 3 months they should rack up a few. Once you have these along with the other facts should be able to make it go away...

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Look up the TrueQ VD letter, and tailor it to your state's statutes.

BTW, the lack of the 30 day notice is a clear FDCPA violation. Just sayin'

Bob, I don't know how the state statutes would apply. This would just be a letter asking for validation and informing them of a disability situation. I don't think there are any state statutes involved with that . . . is there? :confused:

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Okay . . . let's start critiquing this! BTW, do you have to say FDCPA in a DV letter? I've always wondered is mentioning those words, precisely doing anything?

Anyway, here's the letter - I'd appreciate any and all feedback!

Dear Collection Manager,

This letter is in response to your letter dated __________, 2010 (copy enclosed) regarding the collection on the debt account given above.

Please send the following documents:

1. Authenticated cardmember agreement for this account.

2. Complete payment history from a zero balance up to the amount of the alleged debt.

3. Credit card statements verifying account number and account holder.

4. Authenticated evidence of the agreement or sale of the alleged debt between the original creditor and ______________.

I do not recognize this debt and therefore I dispute this account.

I also would like to inform you that I am totally and permanently disabled and have been since 2005. My only income is social security disability which cannot be garnished for debts such as this alleged debt. For over 30 years of being a credit card holder, I always paid as promised and had excellent credit until my health suddenly declined and I could no longer work. After facing the reality of the situation and talking with my creditors, I sold my house in 2006 and paid them what I could. Each creditor was well aware of what had happened. This is not a situation that I readily welcomed and I tried to do the best I could with the debts I owed.

Also, please note that on my old defaulted accounts, there were cardmember agreements with the option to elect arbitration - if either party chose. If you pursue this matter further, please know that I don't want my arbitration rights waived.

Thank you for your time.

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Forgot to ask, should she send a copy of her social security award letter or bank statements showing the deposits or maybe mention if they need further documentation, etc.? Or the fact they can see her credit report ought to validate the sell of her house, etc. . . . .

Also, the way I mentioned arbitration - does that sound good enough to let them know that she has it and they better let her have the option to choose it - without saying she definitely wants it? Does that make any sense? :confused:

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Guest chuckygee

Linda,

I think you are overanalyzing this.

Last things first. Electing arbitration before the suit is to prevent a lawsuit from being filed. If you are not trying to prevent a lawsuit, mentioning arbitration is useless. It just gives them a heads up to try to circumvent the option of arbitration; like filing in small claims court if there is an exemption.

Second, I understand the reason for stating your current financial situation, but I do not understand the reason for stating what lead to the default. The collectors could care less about how you got here, and the information could be used against you to confirm the debt is yours. Comparing the date of the house sell with large payments made to the card could be evidence to prove you were aware of the account. Leave it out.

I do not recognize this debt and therefore I dispute this account. is the most important sentence in the letter. It is a cease and desist in effect. (I hope that was what you were going for)

The reason for stating FDCPA is that insures that they will at least respond to what is required by the law. You already know that the other items are not required.

Just to be clear, this letter will likely get you sued in court. So I hope that is the intent.

Also, I would not send them ANY personal documentation.

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I would remove this section:

For over 30 years of being a credit card holder, I always paid as promised and had excellent credit until my health suddenly declined and I could no longer work. After facing the reality of the situation and talking with my creditors, I sold my house in 2006 and paid them what I could. Each creditor was well aware of what had happened. This is not a situation that I readily welcomed and I tried to do the best I could with the debts I owed.

Reason: it sounds like acknowledging the debt. I'm not sure there is any harm in mentioning the disability and only income is Social Security.

Also, remove this section:

Also, please note that on my old defaulted accounts, there were cardmember agreements with the option to elect arbitration - if either party chose. If you pursue this matter further, please know that I don't want my arbitration rights waived.

Again, it is like acknowledging the debt. Instead, say something like:

If there is an arbitration clause in the cardmember agreement, I elect arbitration to resolve all disputes between you and me.

.

Edited by nobk4me
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Okay - how about this?

Dear Collection Manager,

This letter is in response to your letter dated __________, 2010 (copy enclosed) regarding the collection on the debt account given above.

Please send the following documents:

1. Authenticated cardmember agreement for this account.

2. Complete payment history from a zero balance up to the amount of the alleged debt.

3. Credit card statements verifying account number and account holder.

4. Authenticated evidence of the agreement or sale of the alleged debt between the original creditor and ______________.

I do not recognize this debt and therefore I dispute this account.

I would also like to inform you that I am totally and permanently disabled and have been since 2005. My only income is social security disability which cannot be garnished for debts such as this alleged debt.

If there is an arbitration clause in the cardmember agreement, I elect arbitration to resolve all disputes between you and me.

Thank you for your time.

***********Now, some questions . . . I didn't mention FDCPA as I know the information they require is pretty skimpy and doesn't hold up to my list. Is that okay to leave it out? Or should I mention the part about them needing to go back to the original creditor to get verification?

Also, the part about electing arbitration - what "if" the cardmember agreement they send, isn't satisfactory? When or how do I give them the cardmember agreement that I want to use?

And should I leave the date of disability 2005, in there or take the date out?

Thank you all!! :)++

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IMO leave out the date of disability and all other information related income and disability. No reason to start quoting FDCPA, they should know what they are suppose to send back. Further you start quoting laws and information they might actually change their behavior.

You want them to violate, so why let them know you know the rules? Play dumb consumer for a while, and send some coorespondence back and forth to gather voilations, then pull your knowledge out of your back pocket and shove it in their face.

I think many times we try to rush things, when a better tatic is to play along and see where the CA stands, or waiting to see how a court suit develops. Think about all the post you read, PRO SE is always going for MTD, for some reason and this rarely materializes. So would a better tatic be to take time and effort spent on MTD, into Discovery or MTC arb, or MTS affiants, learning how to preculde evidence....

Good Luck and again very nice of you to help this person.

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I thought keeping it as simple as possible was the way to go. Isn't Trueq's letter a bit outdated? (no offense to Trueq-as I think he's amazing).

I would not give a CA any details or personal information about me or admit anything about a debt that they do not already know. Election of arb is not the same as initiating. As far as going to small claims, one can always get it moved to another court.

I thought all the accounting info was stuff asked once suit has begun.

Just keep a DV as simple as possible. They probably won't read it anyway and you can probably start counting violations.

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Guest BrokeBob
Bob, I don't know how the state statutes would apply. This would just be a letter asking for validation and informing them of a disability situation. I don't think there are any state statutes involved with that . . . is there? :confused:

Depends on your state. Trueq and I both live in Wisconsin. In Wisconsin, under Wisc. Stats. s. 425.109, there are certain things which must be provided to the consumer IF THE CONSUMER REQUESTS THEM. I have no idea what the Georgia laws are. If there are no similar laws in Georgia, write something a lot more generic.

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Guest BrokeBob
I thought keeping it as simple as possible was the way to go. Isn't Trueq's letter a bit outdated? (no offense to Trueq-as I think he's amazing).

I would not give a CA any details or personal information about me or admit anything about a debt that they do not already know. Election of arb is not the same as initiating. As far as going to small claims, one can always get it moved to another court.

I thought all the accounting info was stuff asked once suit has begun.

Just keep a DV as simple as possible. They probably won't read it anyway and you can probably start counting violations.

It's a matter of style. In many cases, simplest is best. See my recent response to a similar thread bt oregonpilot.

As far as trueq's letter, remember that is tailored (a) to Wisconsin Statutes and (B) to trueq's particular circumstances, for example the stuff on possible identity theft. In MY situation, I have been the victim of identity theft in the past, so I left in something like that in my DV letter. OTOH, I left out a LOT of stuff, and pared it down to a mere 3 pages. :p In some cases, I send a 1 page pared down version. No matter, they ignore everything the want to ignore in over 90% of the cases. I can only remember ONE time when a CA made reference to ANY of the particular clauses in the DV letter. Even then, they ignored whatever I demanded that they didn't have or didn't feel like sending.

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I have one more question - I'm still a little concerned with saying "I elect arbitration" without fully knowing what the cardmember's agreement might say. What if we say we elect arbitration and then it comes back that it is not too consumer friendly?

Is there a way to say that "we" the consumer would like the opportunity to view the cardmember agreement and consider electing arbitration before any litigation begins - or something to that effect?

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Posted twice now - talking about the completely fictious benefits of a DV/arb letter is a violation of TOS.

This "letter" was conjured up as an experiment by one of our non-legal professional members to see if it would help. No evidence whatever it does any good, and I refuse to let people be led astray by this kind of nonsense.

http://debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304014

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Posted twice now - talking about the completely fictious benefits of a DV/arb letter is a violation of TOS.

This "letter" was conjured up as an experiment by one of our non-legal professional members to see if it would help. No evidence whatever it does any good, and I refuse to let people be led astray by this kind of nonsense.

http://debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304014

You're mistaken there! It's 2 different letters. I have read where others that had mentioned disability in DV letters and was trying to get feedback from others in addition to other questions like the FDCPA, etc. And as you read the thread - we were "exchanging" thoughts and ideas.

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BTW, what does this mean in your post above -

"talking about the completely fictious benefits of a DV/arb letter is a violation of TOS."

Did I say something wrong? I hope not - that's why I posted this in the arbitration forum where it is already tagged with a warning - "USE THE ADVICE IN THIS FORUM AT YOUR PERIL!"

If I did something wrong, I certainly didn't mean to. I thought we could exchange thoughts and ideas.

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I found this, but I can't find anything about it being TOS - it was just part of a stickee.

1. Telling people to use Debt Validation if they've been notified about being sued. Sorry - but we've discussed this to death and this is not a valid tool when fighting court. If you send the mythical "DV arbitration" letter and get results - it's because they are listening to the arbitration language and not the debt validation language. This will not be tolerated in ANY way.

If this is what was meant by admin, let me explain my understanding of the above and I'm sorry if I misread it. I didn't tell anybody anything about using a DV letter in relation to being sued. We were talking about sending a DV letter with no mention of anything already being filed in court - just in response to collection letters. The second part of the above - I don't quite understand what it is even meaning. I think it being in the same paragraph with mention of a DV letter after being sued, kinda throws everybody off. I honestly don't understand what is meant beyond the part of "this is not a valid tool when fighting court." I see the part about "will not be tolerated in ANY way." - but, I don't understand what won't be tolerated? Saying to send a DV letter after being sued (of course, this wouldn't work - it would be too late to DV then!) or saying to someone if they got results from a DV letter that mentioned arbitration, that it was the arbitration talk and not the debt validation talk?

I'm sorry - I'm just confused about this! I didn't say nor did I see anyone saying to send a DV letter after being sued. I also didn't see any mention of anyone getting results and bragging that it was the arbitration language . . . and those two things seem to be what was on the no-no list or am I still missing something about the TOS? If so . . . someone point me in the right direction as I'm certainly not trying to do anything wrong - I'm just trying to understand.

If "I" ask a question - isn't it alright to get feedback? No one "told" me - I "asked" and I realize it is at my own peril to use this part of the forum.

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Guest BrokeBob

Yes, this is terra incognita, butI have posted clear, raw data on this.

In three occasions, I have sent in a DV letter with election of arbitration.

In one case, the top law debt collection firm in Wisconsin, and one of the very best in the US, walked away from a case. This firm NEVER walks away from a case, but they did after I sent them a DV letter with arbitration.

In the other cases, the firms filed anyway.

In another case, I filed a number of counter claims, one of which was for suing after election of arbitration. I expect that to be eventually settled. In a few weeks, I will file a MTD on several grounds, one of which will be improper venue. HOWEVER, there are already enough grounds for dismissal even without that.

In the third case, I will file a MTD in a few weeks. Even though the motion has not been filed, I already know when it will be heard (in about a month and a half). By that time, I may know if I can get a case dismissed on those grounds.

Npw, if I do get a case dismissed on the grounds of pre-suit election of arbitration, OR I get some $ out of a claim or counter claim for suing after arbitration was elected, am I permitted to reveal that?

OTOH, there may be a NDA. So, if this does NOT work, I will reveal that. If it DOES work and there is no NDA, I will reveal that. If it DOES work and there is a NDA, I may mention the case is no longer active, and let people draw their own conclusions.

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In the very least, a DV can be useful to induce FDCPA violations. That was part of my claim against a CA LAW firm. That case is over, waiting on the release. Result, the CA lawfirm is off the case, and they gotta pay $2350 before they bow out. The debt is still hanging around but a few more of those can't hurt....P>S> Before we gotta hear about Dving in court and it's useless stuff and to perhaps provide clarity, They never gotta chance to file suit, there was NO court case...

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