Back from court!

[lisser]

I am on cloud 9 right now. My hearing for my MTC arbitration was today at 1pm. I get there early so I can go over my documents and practice in my head what I am going to say.

I go in court room at 12:45p and the judge is still going over some cases from the 11am docket so there are only like 3 people beside myself and my mom in the courtroom. He finishes with the 11am docket and gets up so the baliff says "all rise." So we all get up and the judge says, "naaahhh, don't worry about it." We all laughed. I was happy bc he seemed to be in a good mood.

He comes back in for the 1pm docket. We all rise, he says, "please be seated." He calls some estate cases and just signs off on them. Then he says "Cap 1 vs blah blah." It wasn't me though. So I see that the atty for my case is there so I become even more nervous. The case that's before mine with Cap 1 the defendant is not there but his atty is. I listed and the defendant's atty's argument was that Cap 1 couldn't provide a signed valid agreement. The judge didn't want to hear that, he said Mr. So and So used the card, it's valid, so he set that one for a jury trial. I wanted so bad for that defendant to be there so I could tell him about arbitration but he wasn't there.

So here comes my case. I walk up to the bench and the judge says to Cap 1 atty, "Well Mr. blah blah, I've read Ms. me's motion and is she right? Is there an arbitration agreement? (remember I attached the agreement to the motion, the judge had access to it, but I know they do not have the time to read all that crap). Cap 1 atty says, "yes judge she is right." Judge says, "Mr. Cap 1 atty, I think you should offer Ms. Me a job at your firm bc she obvisously knows more than you do." I about DIED!!!! Cap 1 atty says, "judge we want to make sure Ms. me knows how expensive arbitration is and we want her to initiate it." The judge says, "well I don't see how I can force her to initiate it, just someone initiate it, I'm staying this case pending arbitration" then he goes on to write an order when I say, "judge I've already written an order for your convenience and I've got a copy here for Mr. Cap 1 atty as well (insert angelic smile here)." Then the judge says, "You have! Thank you so much Ms. me!"

So the Cap 1 atty makes fun of my order bc it has spots to mark an X or a check mark. I ignore the remark bc I know he's steaming. the judge starts to write some things on the order (I thought) and then says, "ok thank you very much, and here is your order Ms. Me." I say, "thank you your honor" then he says, "oh are you going to use that order again (I have no idea why he said that, I think he was just trying to talk to me) and I just shrugged my shoulders and gave another angelic smile. The whole courtroom laughed!!! It was GREAT!

My mom was sitting there for moral support and she said the people behind her asked her if I was an atty!!! HA!!!!!!

Of course after I walked out of the courthouse Cap 1's atty tried to tell me all about how expensive arbitration will be for me, how Cap 1 took it out of their cardmember agreement bc it was so expensive for their customers (puke). I of course schooled him on arbitration. He then said, "let's reach an agreement." I said, "mr. cap 1 atty, I called your office on August 23rd and offered you 40% and your para legal said no." He acted like he had no knowledge of this but said, "Ok I accept 40%." I said, "that offer is no longer available, have a good day." I walked away.

So now I'm a little confused...should I call the courthouse and get transcripts of what went down? Will they mail me the order?

Did I do good???

[lisser]

I need to thank each of you also. Without the support and documentation you all provided me with, there is no way I would have gotten this far, so thank you, thank you, thank you!

I will never be able to thank you guys but I hope each of you know how grateful I am to you all.

[RebelLady]

LISSER, LISSER, LISSER....you didn't do GOOD...you DID PERFECT and I give you a BIG 10!!!!!!!!!!!

Its funny but I have been thinking about you on and off all day...I KNEW you could do IT!!!!!

MAN...I AM AS PROUD AS YOUR MOM COULD POSSIBLY BE!!!!!!!

CONGRATS, CONGRATS, CONGRATS and CONGRATS!!!!!

Hell...that last line had me clapping for ya!!!!!!!!

xdancexxdancexxdancexxdancexxdancex

RL

[lisser]

Thank you darlin! I just wish I knew what the hell to do from here, I think I need to see the order the judge wrote. I guess it will come in the mail to me?

[RebelLady]

For sure and it will...in the meantime...pat yourself on the back and congratulate yourself on a job well done!!!

RL

[Massive]

I am on cloud 9 right now. My hearing for my MTC arbitration was today at 1pm. I get there early so I can go over my documents and practice in my head what I am going to say.

I go in court room at 12:45p and the judge is still going over some cases from the 11am docket so there are only like 3 people beside myself and my mom in the courtroom. He finishes with the 11am docket and gets up so the baliff says "all rise." So we all get up and the judge says, "naaahhh, don't worry about it." We all laughed. I was happy bc he seemed to be in a good mood.

He comes back in for the 1pm docket. We all rise, he says, "please be seated." He calls some estate cases and just signs off on them. Then he says "Cap 1 vs blah blah." It wasn't me though. So I see that the atty for my case is there so I become even more nervous. The case that's before mine with Cap 1 the defendant is not there but his atty is. I listed and the defendant's atty's argument was that Cap 1 couldn't provide a signed valid agreement. The judge didn't want to hear that, he said Mr. So and So used the card, it's valid, so he set that one for a jury trial. I wanted so bad for that defendant to be there so I could tell him about arbitration but he wasn't there.

So here comes my case. I walk up to the bench and the judge says to Cap 1 atty, "Well Mr. blah blah, I've read Ms. me's motion and is she right? Is there an arbitration agreement? (remember I attached the agreement to the motion, the judge had access to it, but I know they do not have the time to read all that crap). Cap 1 atty says, "yes judge she is right." Judge says, "Mr. Cap 1 atty, I think you should offer Ms. Me a job at your firm bc she obvisously knows more than you do." I about DIED!!!! Cap 1 atty says, "judge we want to make sure Ms. me knows how expensive arbitration is and we want her to initiate it." The judge says, "well I don't see how I can force her to initiate it, just someone initiate it, I'm staying this case pending arbitration" then he goes on to write an order when I say, "judge I've already written an order for your convenience and I've got a copy here for Mr. Cap 1 atty as well (insert angelic smile here)." Then the judge says, "You have! Thank you so much Ms. me!"

So the Cap 1 atty makes fun of my order bc it has spots to mark an X or a check mark. I ignore the remark bc I know he's steaming. the judge starts to write some things on the order (I thought) and then says, "ok thank you very much, and here is your order Ms. Me." I say, "thank you your honor" then he says, "oh are you going to use that order again (I have no idea why he said that, I think he was just trying to talk to me) and I just shrugged my shoulders and gave another angelic smile. The whole courtroom laughed!!! It was GREAT!

My mom was sitting there for moral support and she said the people behind her asked her if I was an atty!!! HA!!!!!!

Of course after I walked out of the courthouse Cap 1's atty tried to tell me all about how expensive arbitration will be for me, how Cap 1 took it out of their cardmember agreement bc it was so expensive for their customers (puke). I of course schooled him on arbitration. He then said, "let's reach an agreement." I said, "mr. cap 1 atty, I called your office on August 23rd and offered you 40% and your para legal said no." He acted like he had no knowledge of this but said, "Ok I accept 40%." I said, "that offer is no longer available, have a good day." I walked away.

So now I'm a little confused...should I call the courthouse and get transcripts of what went down? Will they mail me the order?

Did I do good???

You say the case before did not require a valid agreement? What an idiot judge. You may have liked him, but that debtors lawyer was an idiot if he didn't object.

Good job though in regards to your case.

[lisser]

Yep the defendant's lawyer did not object. The judge even said that he knew he should be able to provide the signed contract and the Cap1 lawyer flat out said he did not have one to provide. The judge continued it and set for a jury trial and the judge said he was going to allow the evidence that has already been entered stay.

The defendant should have came to court and seen what his money was paying for, crap defense! Even if you hire an atty I'm a firm believer on educating yourself as well. I don't agree with the judge on what he said about the agreement but I was sure happy with how he handled my case! That judge is one of my favorite people right now hahahaaa!!!

[lisser]

For sure and it will...in the meantime...pat yourself on the back and congratulate yourself on a job well done!!!

RL

So the order the judge signs off on will be mailed to me?

I wonder if I can get a transcript of everything he said. I would like to frame it

[RebelLady]

Not sure about your courts but in our's there's a camera running and recording the proceedings. You might ask and find out. It would be a really nice keepsake...lol or possibly something to look at over and over when you're really, really, really extremely bored with absolutely nothing else to do in the entire universe but amuse yourself with the blathering of a completely idiotic alleged attorney who is still 'practicing' law but hasn't gotten it quite right yet...lololol

RL

[skippy1960]

Lisser,

How wonderful for you remember "Success is not an accident, it happens when opportunity meets preperation".

Take a deep breath and enjoy the win, I am sure we will all have some ideas on how to proceed that you can make a final choice on. It is great to hear that 40% is doable, that means so is 0%.

Nothing like music to your ears when counsel is talking about how expensive private arbitration will be, little does he know that will be your very arguement that he will have to decide in the future if he wants to proceed based on OC paying those expensive fee's. He still doesn't get it yet.

Great Job.

[nobk4me]

Congrats!! You did it! Another arb victory!

[rikkivs]

I've been watching from the sidelines because I don't know much about arbitration strategies at all, but we all have the infamous and wonderful Trueq, MG05, Broke Bob, TBird Lady, Skippy and others to thank for that! Congratulations!!!! ALL OF US ARE SO VERY PROUD OF YOU!!! I know that the nerve wrecked,teeth biting moments that these processes tend to create but you persevered through it all! Good for you. Now comes the easy part. You really have them in a bind because the cost of arbitration will likely equal or exceed the amount for which they were suing.

Now, Skippy and others who know this strategy, what is the next step? Since they will likely not want to pay for arbitration proceedings, what can Lisser do? Offer them zero percent for real or five percent or what?

And is there any chance whatsoever that they will pay for arbitration if the suit is a large enough amount?

[nobk4me]

I think the amount of the debt is fairly small here, and she was willing to settle for 40% of that. So I would suggest settlement talks, starting at zero.

[RebelLady]

Now, Skippy and others who know this strategy, what is the next step? Since they will likely not want to pay for arbitration proceedings, what can Lisser do? Offer them zero percent for real or five percent or what?

And is there any chance whatsoever that they will pay for arbitration if the suit is a large enough amount?

There is always a chance they will pursue this in arbitration. It will depend on what they perceive as their chances of 'winning', how much it will cost them and how much they stand to gain. Should they decide to pursue this through the arbitration process and 'win'...AAA and JAMS, unlike NAF, have an appeals process. So you can still get another shot at 'winning'. Then, if you should lose in arbitration and lose your appeal in arbitration, the OC still has to have it confirmed in court. So you get yet another shot at vacating the award.

Remember...arbitration isn't an end in itself. Arbitration is simply a means to an end. The end is a settlement that is satisfactory to everybody. Apparently the OC in this case didn't think the offer of 40% was enough. They probably thought they could get an SJ in court and could collect 100% so why settle for 40%? Since their victory isn't quite as assured as it was in the days of NAF, its very possible now that they will make a better offer...like 15%-20%.

And also remember, the attorney they used in court may not be at all familiar with arbitration or may decide its too time-consuming or whatever and hand it back to the OC. The OC might decide that hiring someone who is familiar with arbitration is waaaayyyy too expensive and decide its not worth pursuing.

If they do pursue it and it was me, I would first of all download the Rules of Procedure for whichever arbitration forum they choose. I would read and become very familiar with them (and I mean, like, best friend familiar...lol). Then I would start preparing myself...making decisions as I would if this was going to court...preparing for Discovery, looking at what they've provided so far in the way of 'evidence' and seeing how I might be able to rip it to pieces, looking for holes in their case, making decisions that I feel will best advance my case to the arbitrator. In fact, if it was me, I would already be downloading the Rules of Procedure for any available arbitration forum and start immediately to becoming familiar with them...just in case...lol

RL

p.s. A little aside from my own personal experience. I am being sued in Small Claims Court and I know that the evidence the JDB has provided isn't enough to get a judgment. But I also know that if an OC, a CA or a JDB appear in a court in this county with someone's name written in crayon on a piece of toilet paper with an amount (you pick the amount), they will get the judgment...been there, done that. So, I already know how to best tear their 'evidence' to pieces...but now I have to worry about how it should look...making sure all the i's are dotted and all the t's crossed and the spacing is such-and-such and the margins and tabs are formatted properly or else it will be rejected by the court! MY court...the court that's supposed to be weighing evidence...NOT formatting errors!! Arbitration, on the other hand, is much less formal. You can represent yourself and be just as familiar with the Rules of Procedure as the OC, CA or JDB or any attorney they might use against you...

RL

Edited September 9, 2010 by RebelLady

[RebelLady]

I think the amount of the debt is fairly small here, and she was willing to settle for 40% of that. So I would suggest settlement talks, starting at zero.

Wow...that's an awfully high figure to start with...good grief!!

RL

[BrokeBob]

STEP 1:

I were you, I would call up the court clerk ASAP, and ask the clerk about the order. Find out what you have to do to get the order. Every state, and often every county, has its own rules. In some places, YOU may be responsible for getting the order to the opposing atty. Make sure you find out the EXACT procedure.

STEP 2: Once you have the order, see what it says. Remember, you don't know exactly what boxes the judge checked. If the judge orders THEM to initiate, or if the judge did not specify, you can probably get a mutual walk away. Demand all they sign off the the debt is completely cancelled, make sure it is completely removed from all credit reports, NO 1099-C! If the judge ordered YOU to initiate (which seems unlikely), offer a mutual walk away, and maybe agree to 5% or even 10% if you can afford it, and you just want this to go away. If you want to fight, don't budge from a mutual walk away.

STEP 3: CELEBRATE! This is fantastic!

xdancexxdancexxdancexxdancexxdancexxdancexxdancex

[BrokeBob]

So the order the judge signs off on will be mailed to me?

I wonder if I can get a transcript of everything he said. I would like to frame it

The debt collector atty made a BIG mistake. Not good to p*** off a judge!

[Linda7]

Congratulations, Lisser! You handled that like a trooper!!

[lisser]

The debt collector atty made a BIG mistake. Not good to p*** off a judge!

LOL I love you Bob I don't think the debt collector pissed the judge off, I just think the judge found it funny that me, a lil ole pro se'r obviously knew more than the lawyer did and that I had him by the gazongas (am I allowed to say that on here?). The judge was very nice to both of us. He made me feel very comfortable. The judge chuckled a lot. The Cap1 attorney kept his cool and gave me the impression that he knew he was screwed once I made him realize I did know a lot about arbitration (thanks to this board, the other board and very nice members on each taking the time out to explain things to me).

I wanted so bad to look behind me and see his face when I told him the 40% offer was no longer available and to have a nice day. I couldn't do it though. I just had to keep walking hoping my mom was following me. I had to tell my mom a head of time to not say anything bc she's ready to just pay the debt for me 100% prior to this. Now she wants to pay to send me to law school! hahahaha!!!

Thank you for all the kind words, pats on the back and suggestions. I will call the courthouse first thing tomorrow and find out what I need to do to get the order. I assume it will be available as early as tomorrow since my hearing was today?

Thanks again guys. I won't ever be able to say it enough.

[chuckygee]

Expect a FedEx letter from Cap1 counsel with an invitation to contact them to reach an "amiable settlement". Stick to your guns. This will be a new counsel or firm. Tell them that 40% is off the table that offer was already rejected. Once you reach a settlement, make sure EVERYTHING that you have agreed to is in the document they will send you. If it is not to your agreement or liking, have them make the changes.

Once this is done, expect not to be able to talk about the details. Those darn Non-Disclosure Agreements.

[lisser]

How come they send this Fed Ex? Bc it can be tracked? So I can't discuss the details even on here under an alias? POOOO!!!!

So say I get this Fed Ex letter, I have to call them? Do I make them an offer or do they make me an offer. I'll be happy to offer $0 No problemo.

[skippy1960]

Things go step by step, so don't start counting chickens before they hatch, enjoy your victory in the battle, but the war isn't over yet. Take a respite, but know that there are still some steps to go..

[Jerseygirl500]

I bow to the QUEEN! Keep us posted on everything that expires up until the point that you have to sign the non-disclosure agreements. I think you missed your calling and your mom may be correct. Ever think about law school?

[Jerseygirl500]

Sorry, I meant to say everything that TRANSPIRES, not "expires."

[lisser]

I wouldn't mind going to law school but I'm in my mid 30s so I sort of feel like I'm too old to conquer another college degree, especially one as advanced as a law degree. It's sort of funny saying "advanced" since I schooled a lawyer yesterday and all I have is a Bachelors in Social Work!