How to look up a person's SSN to enforce a judgment

[Gandolf]

I won a judgment for 7500 over a former business partner and am planning to garnish their bank accounts. I have all this person's info, full name, DOB, address, name of banks, ect. Basically, everything EXCEPT for their SSN. How can I go about looking this info up? I ask because I need it to fill out one of the court forms.

[Guest usctrojanalum]

PM sent.

[WhoCares1000]

No need for an SSN if you have a bank number. Just file in the court for a writ of levy, pass that off to the sheriff with the appropriate fee who will pass it off to the bank who will be required to make the levy or report back a good reason why they didn't (such as account closed).

MD law may allow you to request the SSN when requesting financial information to enforce a judgment but don't count on it because then you may have to go through a lot of trouble to secure the data.

From these postings, I am gathering that you have some sort of vendetta against this person. That is fine but realize that it sounds like you are letting this control you. If you do let it control you, you are going to make a mistake and mess things up. Step back and think about what your are doing and how you are going about it before acting. Otherwise you may find yourself on the wrong side of the law.

[Gandolf]

No need for an SSN if you have a bank number. Just file in the court for a writ of levy, pass that off to the sheriff with the appropriate fee who will pass it off to the bank who will be required to make the levy or report back a good reason why they didn't (such as account closed).

MD law may allow you to request the SSN when requesting financial information to enforce a judgment but don't count on it because then you may have to go through a lot of trouble to secure the data.

From these postings, I am gathering that you have some sort of vendetta against this person. That is fine but realize that it sounds like you are letting this control you. If you do let it control you, you are going to make a mistake and mess things up. Step back and think about what your are doing and how you are going about it before acting. Otherwise you may find yourself on the wrong side of the law.

I only have the name of the banks this person uses, not the account numbers. He has a common name so I need a unigue identifier to make sure they locate him and his assets. Plus, the form specifically requests his SSN so that is why I asked for help. I'm not looking to break any laws with this. I just know that he will not comply and give me his info, even if he was brought into court I could see him lying. If he didn't lie, he would just immediately go and move his assets.

[Flyingifr]

You have his name, address and DOB - SSN should not be necessary for the bank to determine which person of that name the levy belongs to.

[jq26]

You shouldn't need it, but I have access. If you PM me the name and date of birth and address, I will give you the first five digits of their SSN.

PM me. DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES POST THIS INFORMATION ON THIS WEBSITE.

[WhoCares1000]

I only have the name of the banks this person uses, not the account numbers. He has a common name so I need a unigue identifier to make sure they locate him and his assets. Plus, the form specifically requests his SSN so that is why I asked for help. I'm not looking to break any laws with this. I just know that he will not comply and give me his info, even if he was brought into court I could see him lying. If he didn't lie, he would just immediately go and move his assets.

Name, address, and DOB should usually work.

As for lying on the Financial statements or in court, most people would not dare do that. The financial statements are usually signed under penalty of perjury and if in court, you testify under oath. Perjury is a big no-no and if he did do that and if it could be proven, that would result in some serious fines and jail/prison time.

As for hiding assets, welcome to the cat and mouse game of judgment collection. It happens all the time. That is why they say that obtaining a judgment is only 1/2 the battle.

I still don't understand why you do not try a wage garnishment first. I know you have to wait but it is quite a bit harder to change jobs than to hid bank assets (especially in this economy).

[Gandolf]

Name, address, and DOB should usually work.

As for lying on the Financial statements or in court, most people would not dare do that. The financial statements are usually signed under penalty of perjury and if in court, you testify under oath. Perjury is a big no-no and if he did do that and if it could be proven, that would result in some serious fines and jail/prison time.

As for hiding assets, welcome to the cat and mouse game of judgment collection. It happens all the time. That is why they say that obtaining a judgment is only 1/2 the battle.

I still don't understand why you do not try a wage garnishment first. I know you have to wait but it is quite a bit harder to change jobs than to hid bank assets (especially in this economy).

I appreciate your attempt to help me, but I'm unclear why you keep trying to find fault with what I'm doing, rather than provide assistance to the actual questions I'm asking. Regarding you not understanding why I am after the bank account as opposed to wage garnishment, this person doesn't have a steady job but has some sketchy kind of self employed gig which would make it difficult to garnish. If he had a steady job at a reputable company, of course this would have been an easier way to garnish his money. Now, I know you had no way to know that, but that's why it would be more helpful to simply answer the questions I ask rather than make assumptions about what I should or shouldn't be doing.

Again, I appreciate you trying to help me and I don't want to sound ungrateful, but please understand that you don't know all the details of this case and many of these details would explain why I am doing things the way I am. As I stated, the form for bank garnishment specifically asks for the debtor's SSN so I didn't want to take a chance on not having that. Luckily, one of the members here helped me with that and I am now ready to move forward.

[WhoCares1000]

I am not against what you are trying to do. I just do not seem to think that you have researched this issue through before acting (and it is fine to ask questions but I would have thought that one looking to collect on a judgment would first look to learn and understand the state exemptions and garnishment/levy rules).

Second, since you have not given all the details, one is not going to know the situation enough to understand why you do not follow the easiest steps first. Knowing now that the debtor is self-employed changes my advice.

Finally, as far as an SSN for a bank, I would bet that if you walked into the bank with the sheriff and a court order with the persons name, address, and DOB, they would find the account you are looking for unless the branch manager would be interested in explaining why they need a SSN to a judge in an Order Show Cause Hearing.

My suggestion to you is to research besides bank and asset levies, what a financial statement is and how to procure one, and what happens when a debtor does not fill out the financial statement or commits perjury on a financial statement or in court. I also suggest that you step back and learn the judgment enforcement process. Talk to the sheriff before acting. Get the schedule of fees from the sheriff (hint, most of them are on the Sheriff's website). Get the schedule of fees from the court for various actions. Understand why it is not a good idea to seize depreciating assets except as a last resort. Learn also what assets you can seize of a self-employed person as well as different business structures. It will be easier to seize the assets of a sole-proprietorship for example than someone who has created an LLC or a corporation. When to levy the stock in an LLC or Corporation and when not to bother). What accounts receivables are and how to levy those.

From the way to acted when you started here, you had revenge on your mind which clouds ones judgment and hence, you land you in trouble. It also keeps one from learning. Don't worry about time. You have 12 years to collect on a judgment and you may even be able to charge interest. Relax and take your time. You are probably going to enter a cat and mouse game with this person and will do so for a while. Just understand the system and you will catch the debtor sooner or later. Don't understand the system and the debtor will beat you every time.

[Gandolf]

I am not against what you are trying to do. I just do not seem to think that you have researched this issue through before acting (and it is fine to ask questions but I would have thought that one looking to collect on a judgment would first look to learn and understand the state exemptions and garnishment/levy rules).

Who is to say that I haven't researched any of this? Again, more assumptions.

Second, since you have not given all the details, one is not going to know the situation enough to understand why you do not follow the easiest steps first. Knowing now that the debtor is self-employed changes my advice.

For reasons already stated, I believe I AM following the easiest path. For the business, this person had to show their assets for a merchant applications we were after and I found an e-mail where he listed what types of accounts he had and with which banks. I know that I can bring him in for questions at the court, but that would blow the ELEMENT OF SURPRISE which is a very big deal with collecting a judgment. This bank levy might very well be my only chance to get him before he knows what is coming. This is why my question was aimed at finding only the remaining information I need to know for the bank levy. If I fail with the bank levy, I have plans B, C, and D and I don't have the time to go through all that unless it ends up being necessary.

Finally, as far as an SSN for a bank, I would bet that if you walked into the bank with the sheriff and a court order with the persons name, address, and DOB, they would find the account you are looking for unless the branch manager would be interested in explaining why they need a SSN to a judge in an Order Show Cause Hearing.

Again, it asks for the SSN right on the form. Sure, it is very possible that his account could be located without it. But certainly it is not outside of the realm of possibility that leaving blank parts on the form just might cause problems. You keep admonishing me for trying to locate his SSN (which I have already done, via the help of one of the members of this forum). Why on Earth would you think I would be better off leaving out the SSN that they ask for when it was quick and easy to find?

My suggestion to you is to research besides bank and asset levies, what a financial statement is and how to procure one, and what happens when a debtor does not fill out the financial statement or commits perjury on a financial statement or in court.

I have looked into the financial form and questioning in court and that is one of my backup plans if the bank levy is unsuccessful. What did I say to imply that I hadn't looked into that? For the many reasons I have stated, I think the bank levy has a higher probability of working which is why I'm going down that road first.

I also suggest that you step back and learn the judgment enforcement process. Talk to the sheriff before acting. Get the schedule of fees from the sheriff (hint, most of them are on the Sheriff's website). Get the schedule of fees from the court for various actions.

I am researching it every day, with this forum being one of my resources. Just because I come here and ask I question or two doesn't mean that I am clueless or that I am not doing my own due dilligence via multiple other online sources.

Understand why it is not a good idea to seize depreciating assets except as a last resort.

I do understand why seizing depreciating assets is only a last resort...and that is exactly why I am going after this person's bank accounts first.

Learn also what assets you can seize of a self-employed person as well as different business structures. It will be easier to seize the assets of a sole-proprietorship for example than someone who has created an LLC or a corporation. When to levy the stock in an LLC or Corporation and when not to bother). What accounts receivables are and how to levy those.

I don't think much of that will come into play. The judgment is against him personally, and I believe these accounts are his own personaly accounts.

From the way to acted when you started here, you had revenge on your mind which clouds ones judgment and hence, you land you in trouble. It also keeps one from learning.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. I did some research on my own first and had a few questions, so I came here to ask them. While I admit that I feel this person is a piece of garbage and I admit that I would enjoy watching them squirm, my main goal is to get my money and once I do, I will be done with the matter. This person could write me a check today and I'd gladly accept it, shake his hand, wish him luck, and put this behind us. That will never happen though. He will never willingly pay me so he has forced my hand with things, it has nothing at all to do with revenge.

Don't worry about time. You have 12 years to collect on a judgment and you may even be able to charge interest. Relax and take your time. You are probably going to enter a cat and mouse game with this person and will do so for a while. Just understand the system and you will catch the debtor sooner or later.

I know I have time but obviously I'd prefer the money sooned rather than later. Plus, he could move out of the area, file bankruptcy, or do a whole host of other things to mess me up given enough time so I think it's best to strike while the iron is hot and hopefully I won't have to go through the cat and mouse game. I'm willing to do it if it's necessary, but it's almost like you're telling me to wait even though I have a very strong indication of where his assets are and how to get them.

Don't understand the system and the debtor will beat you every time.

Again, I do have a decent understanding of the system. I asked for help finding the debtor's SSN which was the ONLY piece of the puzzle I didn't have. I'm not sure how you equate this with a lack of understanding of the system.

[jq26]

To answer your question directly, most attorneys have access to a database than skip trace people. Any piece of info and I can usually track someone down, including the first five digits of their SSN (the last four digits are masked).

I do not think you'll be able to get the SSN directly. These numbers are highly guarded today- all federal courts and most states courts don't even allow any SSNs in court filings. The rules went into effect roughly two years ago.

[Gandolf]

To answer your question directly, most attorneys have access to a database than skip trace people. Any piece of info and I can usually track someone down, including the first five digits of their SSN (the last four digits are masked).

I do not think you'll be able to get the SSN directly. These numbers are highly guarded today- all federal courts and most states courts don't even allow any SSNs in court filings. The rules went into effect roughly two years ago.

Thanks for the info. I actually was able to get the full SSN with the help of a member of this forum.

[Guest usctrojanalum]

I do not think you'll be able to get the SSN directly. These numbers are highly guarded today-

Look into Accurint for Legal Professionals.

[Templar]

Gramm-Leach-Bliley and Fair Credit Reporting Acts

[Gandolf]

Gramm-Leach-Bliley and Fair Credit Reporting Acts

What about them?

[rippedoff]

How were you able to find it?

Where and to whom are they available?

[Gandolf]

How were you able to find it?

Where and to whom are they available?

As stated in previous posts, a member here used something called Accurint for Legal Professionals. I don't know what exactly it is, but would assume it's some type of database available to those who work in the legal field for accessing information.

[rippedoff]

Why is that legal to collect and disseminate that information?

Why aren't those services subject to the same laws that govern the credit bureaus? They are acting in the same manner.

Giving out any portion of a persons social security number should be banned. Aren't there any laws to protect it?

There is no reason to believe that a lawyer should have any special rights to it. It is banned from court documents and many places, yet it is rampantly given out through back doors.

Giving out a partial is no protection at all. A different partial is given out in other places. Just put them together.

[Templar]

Gramm-Leach-Bliley and Fair Credit Reporting Acts.

Not 100% certain, but I believe these investigative services tracking down things like SSN's must only release information to bonafide attorney's with an expressed need-to-know and a certified authorization to receive this type of information.

Sorta explains why this info is tough for the layman to obtain.

Gramm-Leach-Bliley and Fair Credit Reporting Acts is a morass of legal-ese w/twists and turns IMHO.

[Guest usctrojanalum]

My qualifications as to why I am allowed to access SSN's are below and it is pursuant to the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act and the Drivers Privacy Protection Act

1) For use by persons holding a legal or beneficial interest relating to the consumer (this part satifies the GLBA)

2) Use in connection with a civil, criminal, administrative, or arbitral proceeding, including the service of process, investigation in anticipation of litigation, the execution or enforcement of judgments, or compliance with the orders of any court (this part sastifies my DPPA compliance)

Every 2 years or so I must fill out an application and a pretty big package with questionnaires to determine if I am still eligible to access such information.

[Templar]

Hope you're good and don't have to update your resume.

[rippedoff]

So there's no point to any privacy laws then.

Why do they bother passing them?

The reasons listed could include just about anything. Someone just has to say the right answers and they're in.

Just like the credit report pulling. They have to have a permissible purpose - or just say they do.

What a crock.

And the person here - no offense - just claimed they needed it for a permissible purpose, and someone with access was willing to look it up just like that.

It really ticks me off because a person can jump through a million hoops to change their SS# and identity because of a threat to their life, and then it's just all undone by the internet. Seems like laws to protect citizens are a complete joke on every subject.

[jq26]

Relax. It is just a number. It is one piece of information among many.

The last four digits of a SSN is still required on many court forms.

The database is mostly for skip tracing deadbeats, but there are other purposes as well.

[Guest usctrojanalum]

Yeah, seriously there are not many things people can do with a SSN. Way too many people are paranoid. It is a number what are they going to do with it.

Edited September 27, 2010 by usctrojanalum

[rippedoff]

Everything. And the last 4 digits are printed on many other things so it's easy to compile the info together.

What can be done with it is exactly what you are doing. Finding someone who doesn't want to be found.

It also is easy to use for identity theft.

And don't tell me just being a lawyer makes it ok. Lawyers are often the worst offenders when it comes to unscrupulous. And any sort of debt collector or process server is just about the bottom of the civil scale. Law enforcement looks at stuff they aren't supposed to, but at least there is some sort of trail and accountability.