Asset Acceptance Refusing DV - Help

[spanky34]

I have sent multiple letters to Asset Acceptance demanding validation of a debt. They keep sending me a response that indicates they are unsure of the nature of my request and a printout with an account number on it with a debt amount.

- I have asked for the original document bearing my signature.

- The proof that they now own the debt

- The original creditor (this they did do)

- The method in which interest was calculated to come the the alleged amount owed

- Proof that they have the right do to business in my state (I found their person here on-line)

I have my letters with return receipt, I have a copy of a police report stating my SSN was stolen before the debt was opened. I have also writen letters to the CRAs stating the CA refuses to validate the debt.

They have refused to supply any documents pertaining to the ownership of the account a relationship created with the original creditor.

It has come to the point where I need to file a suit or roll over. Any help on the process would be greatly appreciated.

SOL is up in Feb 2013, but the ding hurts as it is my only one.

Edited March 20, 2012 by spanky34

[BV80]

None of what you've requested is required by the FDPCA to validate a debt. All that's required is the name of the OC and the amount of the debt. The debt has been validated.

The other things you've requested is what you ask for in discovery if you were sued.

You mentioned a police report. Is the account with the original creditor the result of ID theft? Is the OC reporting on your CR?

[spanky34]

Police report - Not sure if the debt is mine. SSN card was stolen in 2005. I had a whole bunch of CC's default in 2006-7 due to financial problems.

As for validation - I was under the impression that a print out with an amount and an acount number was insufficient as per the open letter by the FTC. That for debt validation the CA had to prove they own the debt and that the account is truely mine.

OC not on report

Thanks for the insight

[BV80]

You must be referring to verification of an entry on a CR. Not just plain validation according to the FDCPA. Yes, the FTC has stated that more is required to prove the right to report on a CR, but the Fair Credit Reporting Act doesn't specify proof of ownership, and the FTC doesn't make case law.

Personally, I believe that, in order to report to the credit bureaus, a JDB should have to prove ownership, but that's not the case. The CRAs don't require it. If this were a new entry with 7 years to go, I'd say fight them. Make them prove it. You might have to take them to court. But unless you want to fight, considering there's only a year left and little to no case law to back you up, I'd let it ride.

[debtorshusband]

I don't believe in sending multiple letters asking for debt validation.

I send one.

I have no problem with most of the things you've asked for. I know they're not required to meet the (unspecified) requirements for validation per the FDCPA.

But when they don't send what I need, the second letter says "You have failed to provide me with the information I require to work towards a resolution of this matter. Therefore I am closing my files, and you are not to contact me again."

Regards,

DH

[spanky34]

The SOL for them to sue me is up in Feb 2013. it will still be on the CR untill 2016. But that is off of the last payment per Asset Acceptance. I do not recall making any CC payments back in 2009, I stopped paying in 2007/8 with the remainder of my cards.

My only concern with this is if it may be ID theft since my SSN and other items with personal information were stolen in 2005. I had great credit

[Coltfan1972]

- The original creditor (this they did do).

The reason they did this is because that is your only request, under the FDCPA, they are required to answer.

Your request(s) are not unreasonable, and would have to be provided and shown to you if they sued.

You can to as debtorshusband has advised. That is the best way, if you're going to send a follow up letter (which I would never do, but not wrong).

However, note in his response he states, "information I require." A very fair request, but again, it's what you require, not required by the law.

[debtorshusband]

My only concern with this is if it may be ID theft since my SSN and other items with personal information were stolen in 2005. I had great credit

OK, then I think you stop playing in the DV sandbox. And I'm not sure if Asset Acceptance is the JDB who "owns" the debt now, or if they're just the collector. At this point you don't work with a collector. You contact the current "owner," whoever that is.

Don't bother asking for proof they own the debt, or how they calculated the amount, or proof they're licensed in your state. Zoom in on the heart of the matter: you believe you are the victim of identity theft, you can't find records concerning the alleged account, and you need them to prove this account is yours. If they ever provide proof you can ask for the accounting the amount, and whatever else you need.

Good luck.

DH

[spanky34]

DH,

In your opinion would it be prudent to send them a copy of the police report stating what was stolen and when while in the pursuit of these documents. I am hessitant to give them much information.

[bmc100]

You sent a DV letter, they responded. Hopefully you included a C&D in it. If you did and they try calling you, sue them.

[debtorshusband]

DH,

In your opinion would it be prudent to send them a copy of the police report stating what was stolen and when while in the pursuit of these documents. I am hessitant to give them much information.

Ooh, your questions are getting harder, and are beyond my personal experience.

But...I, like you, would be hesitant to send them personal information. I think it's fine to tell them you've been the victim of identity theft, and that you've filed a police report. But send them a copy of the police report? I would resist. What value would it really have to them? Put the burden on them: If they think they have a valid claim, they must provide you with the proof. This is a case where you might demand to see if they have something with your alleged signature, so you can determine if your signature was forged.

In general, remember this: You are in the position of power. You have something they want - your money. They want it, but they can't get it until you're willing to give it, unless they go to court and get a judgment. Always deal from that position of strength.

If they can't or won't send you their proof, cut things off like I said before, with a Cease Communication order. Let them sue if they wish; it's not something you should be afraid of. If they can't provide you with proof now, why would they go to the expense of a lawsuit just to have to provide it then? I would feel more comfortable submitting a police report as evidence in a lawsuit, as opposed to just sending it to a debt collector. Even then, I might redact (black-out) sensitive things like Social Security number, at least the first time I submitted it.

Good luck.

DH

PS I am not an expert on Credit Repair, but you say this is your only ding. I believe you can dispute this item with the Credit Reporting Agencies, indicating you believe you have been the victim of identity theft. That may reduce the negative impact of the listing.

Edited March 20, 2012 by debtorshusband
Added PS

[legaleagle]

Asset is a junk debt buyer, we see their name here all the time. You should contact the OC and ask for information about this account.....some billing statements, etc. That will give you some info as to what was purchased and where. Gotta play detective, that's really the only way to solve this unless you want to wait until Asset sues you.

[spanky34]

Ooh, your questions are getting harder, and are beyond my personal experience.

In general, remember this: You are in the position of power. You have something they want - your money. They want it, but they can't get it until you're willing to give it, unless they go to court and get a judgment. Always deal from that position of strength.

If they do go to court and the chance they do win a judgement, am I still in a position to file BK? I meet the means test, as I have no income as a student now. I will have an income soon, but am way below the income cut off for the means test for my family size. 1K is easier to handle than 17K

I would prefer to get it wiped off the credit report, as anyone would.

If I contact the original creditor and they fail to give up any of the information I am requiring. do I have a case to have this removed?

Thanks again for all the advice and devil's advocate, I'm glad you folks are here!!

[BV80]

If they do go to court and the chance they do win a judgement, am I still in a position to file BK? I meet the means test, as I have no income as a student now. I will have an income soon, but am way below the income cut off for the means test for my family size. 1K is easier to handle than 17K

I would prefer to get it wiped off the credit report, as anyone would.

If I contact the original creditor and they fail to give up any of the information I am requiring. do I have a case to have this removed?

Thanks again for all the advice and devil's advocate, I'm glad you folks are here!!

As long as an OC or CA is complying with the law (FCRA), they can report. What WE believe should be required to prove the right to report, and what the law requires may be different.

It might require a lawsuit on your part. Then, you'd have to prove your case. We can only sue under the FCRA for certain violations. You'd have to figure out if you can sue under the FCRA or FDCPA. Then, if you find out the account was yours, there goes the ID theft issue.

Regarding a lawsuit by Asset, if they were to sue you, they'd have to prove the account was yours and that they own it. If they were to submit cc statements into evidence, you'd get to examine them. That way you'd know if the account was yours or not. If not, you've got the police report proving ID theft. You could also use that to get them off your CR.

If they don't have cc statements, not only could you win the case, you could possibly use that fact to get them off your CR.

If the account IS yours, they'd still have to prove ownership of the debt.

[spanky34]

Great thanks,

Now what about BK options?

I can file Ch 7 now and will be able to well after the SOL is met.

Worst case senario: when is filing Ch 7 too late. Can it be done after a judgement? Does the judgment get removed from the report or do my accounts stay on the report with a BK notice?

Thanks again, trying to see all the pieces so I know what type of manuverability I have.

Edited March 21, 2012 by spanky34

[spanky34]

____________________

So further investigation.

The credit report states the account was opened up 9/10: I never opened any CC acounts while in school. I'm going to try and get the records from Citibank and see what turns up.

I also disputed the listing with the the 3 CRAs.

Why is CitiBank not reporting the account?

[KentWA]

Sounds more and more like misidentification that identity theft. Asset Acceptance does this all the time due to the limited information they have on a person. Been there, done that, sent the summons to them, cashed their check.

[legaleagle]

Bankruptcy isn't something you just file for and it is automatically granted. What you are doing is requesting permission to file BK. This is federal, all the forms are on line, it isn't as cut and dried as people think. Before the court will let you abscond on all your debts, they take eveything into consideration. The thing that is against you is your age and the fact that you are in college. To the court, that indicates that you have many productive years ahead of you which will allow you to pay off your creditors. They can and may very well deny your petition. The creditors can also object, this can get very expensive. One poster here got a 41K bill from the BK lawyer.

[spanky34]

Well it seems that a lot of your guys advice has paid off.

For one I am covered under the SCRA once I go active in a month. I am protected agaisnt judgement / garnishment for some time.

Two I called the OC and they don't have documents and keep sending me to Asset Acceptance

Asset acceptance openly admitted that they do not have any of the original documents. They just have small tid bits of information they received from the OC. All they have is an account number and a list of charges. Nothing with a signature.

Three they purchased the account 2010 and the lady told me they would be around for a long time trying to collect. Account Defaulted 2/09 and was charged off 2009.

They are listing that the trade line was opened up 2010 when in fact it was opened up in 2007.

I continued to try and get information from the OC but they would either hang up or transfer me to Asset Acceptance.

All the phone calls were recorded and currently in my possession.

It seems that I stand in a good position with this situation considering I have proof that sensitive personal information was stolen, with a statement from the police department. I have recorded proof and open admittance of JDB not having any of the records indicating who really opened the account. And it seems they are reporting the account inappropriatly to the CRA.

More advice please. This is getting addicting.

Any good books out there to help me with this?

[spanky34]

The thing that is against you is your age .

I'm 34 and have 4 kids. I went back to make my self more employable. I'll be making less with the army, they are paying for it, than I would in the civilian sector.

Would the addition of that information change anything?

[legaleagle]

It might. Are you active duty? I was in officer in the Corps of Engineers in another life. Good old Fort Leonard Wood. The Gunny also knows a lot about veteran affairs, he is a retired Marine in law school. (BTO429) We both do everything we can to help all veterans. The good news is that this is a junk debt buyer, very easy to defeat. They won't fight, it costs them more than they can hope to get. What is our military status?

[spanky34]

Active as of June 8th. I PCS May 19th. I'll have orders in hand in April.

Thank you guys for your service and current services. If it wasn't for you guys I wouldn't be doing what I am doing now.

I am planning on writing a letter to the CRA stating the case and that there is no proof that the debt is mine. There is no paper work proving it and I am armed with a police report from 2005 claiming sensitive documents were stolen prior to the opening of this alleged account.

I read about how one person sees the dispute essencially checks his/her or not his/hers and there is no real communication between CRA and those reporting. Since the JDB and OC cannot provide any proof I should be able to get it removed. Please comment.

If I were to get a judgment against them for some violations, could I report the JDB to the CRA?? Turn the tables a bit?

Edited March 21, 2012 by spanky34