SashaM

Horror story with lost mortgage payments and demand for $20K....Ocwen

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attempt by the banks to defraud. Is it possible MachineBike is a bank shill? It sounds to me the conversation shifting is not gonna happen, So we must necessarily shun in this thread comments not related to SashaM's stuff. Let us only discuss the measures to get them to not only admit they were dirty but to make them wish they never had done this to a CIC members grandmother and grandfather.

So things the banks fear most, exposure of bad actions that scurilous employees are engaging in methods that are attributed to the banks them selves. Reports of instances will invarily result in further victims going forward. So the exposure to the state ag and the media I think will bear the most fruit. Sasha if your Grandmother does all that they will never try to pull this on them again.

So I hope that an attorney has contacted you or you have talked with one because it will be be a smackdown for the bank. I can't imagine how a customer who pays on time every time is not given trips on cruises and such because they are supporting the bank really.

Also If I were your granny I would look into not having other accounts with them and closing and transferrring to another bank and telling them you have lost faith in this banks business practices. Make sure she says to the reporters also.

You still do not recognize my reasons for sharing. The moment they convince someone to sign a dead pledge, it may be FRAUD.

The mortgage was seperate from the purchase of the house. They purposely mingled it together so the buyer believe a mortgage was necessary to purchase a house, but IT WAS NOT NECESSARY. You pledge your credit to the lender/servicer, through signing a "mort-gage" you do not benefit from, it is a dead pledge.

I chose to study more in depth how this mortgage stuff works but you sound like you chose to stay on the same path of understanding.

How many terrible things need to happen to some one before they realize there is something else going on that they have not been told?

They even tell us its a dead pledge thrrugh the use of "mort-gage"!

Has anyone been ale to obtain something containing the word "dead" and turns out to be a good thing? They gives us clues (codes) withy the legal words they choose. They will keep taking and taking as long as the public doesnt figure out what is really happening. A mortgage is not legitimate, so how their actions be?

I watched a movie concerning wall street dealers a while ago. Two of the guys were sitting in the cab, the one looked around and said to the other, "look at them, they dont even realize what is happening". Later on one said to the other "You are selling them something you know has NO value". Then out of the whole movie, I heard someone say "mortgage" only once. That gave away what they were refering to. I didnt understand at the time, but I do now. They are selling currency (paper dollars) through a mortgage, knowing the paper dollars do not have any value UNTIL the homeowner works to create the value.

Im here trying to get people to open their eyes sso they understand the true nature of a mortgage and you leave replies making me look like i'm hurting instead of helping. If you can not understand what I have written, don't justify it by trying to put my posts down. Keep your comments to yourself...please. I keep posting even with the negative feed back because I know you are not understanding them, but maybe... eventually, you will. Then when you do understand, you will know why i was persistent.

Edited by machinebike

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Ok MB we have no real problem with you wanting to let people know what your talking about. Maybe just continue on your thread with all your information, but when you go to other peoples thread just post a link to your thread so they can go and read it for themselves, instead of you hijacking and forcing your info in their thread. I think the main problem here is that your hijacking someones thread and it makes it confusing for them. Like I said above if you want someone to see your information just put a little comment that they might want to read your thread for further information and the put the link there. That is nice and easy then all your info is in one place and not all over the board. Plus it is respectful to the posters of the threads. Maybe they do not want your information and just want to deal with their situation in a "traditional" ( do I need to define that for you?) way instead of your way. I hope this makes sense to you.

You still do not recognize my reasons for sharing. The moment they convince someone to sign a dead pledge, it may be FRAUD.

The mortgage was seperate from the purchase of the house. They purposely mingled it together so the buyer believe a mortgage was necessary to purchase a house, but IT WAS NOT NECESSARY. You pledge your credit to the lender/servicer, through signing a "mort-gage" you do not benefit from, it is a dead pledge.

I chose to study more in depth how this mortgage stuff works but you sound like you chose to stay on the same path of understanding.

How many terrible things need to happen to some one before they realize there is something else going on that they have not been told?

They even tell us its a dead pledge thrrugh the use of "mort-gage"!

Has anyone been ale to obtain something containing the word "dead" and turns out to be a good thing? They gives us clues (codes) withy the legal words they choose. They will keep taking and taking as long as the public doesnt figure out what is really happening. A mortgage is not legitimate, so how their actions be?

I watched a movie concerning wall street dealers a while ago. Two of the guys were sitting in the cab, the one looked around and said to the other, "look at them, they dont even realize what is happening". Later on one said to the other "You are selling them something you know has NO value". Then out of the whole movie, I heard someone say "mortgage" only once. That gave away what they were refering to. I didnt understand at the time, but I do now. They are selling currency (paper dollars) through a mortgage, knowing the paper dollars do not have any value UNTIL the homeowner works to create the value.

Im here trying to get people to open their eyes sso they understand the true nature of a mortgage and you leave replies making me look like i'm hurting instead of helping. If you can not understand what I have written, don't justify it by trying to put my posts down. Keep your comments to yourself...please. I keep posting even with the negative feed back because I know you are not understanding them, but maybe... eventually, you will. Then when you do understand, you will know why i was persistent.

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Ok MB we have no real problem with you wanting to let people know what your talking about. Maybe just continue on your thread with all your information, but when you go to other peoples thread just post a link to your thread so they can go and read it for themselves, instead of you hijacking and forcing your info in their thread. I think the main problem here is that your hijacking someones thread and it makes it confusing for them. Like I said above if you want someone to see your information just put a little comment that they might want to read your thread for further information and the put the link there. That is nice and easy then all your info is in one place and not all over the board. Plus it is respectful to the posters of the threads. Maybe they do not want your information and just want to deal with their situation in a "traditional" ( do I need to define that for you?) way instead of your way. I hope this makes sense to you.

Yes it does make sense , thanks for the kind words, its a relief. I will follow the instructions you listed. XtypeX

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I know in my family that everyone helps so if someone comes after me in court or whatever they all rally around like I do when the others have something going on.

I know it is tough and if you can convey to your Grandparents my continued well wishes and full support that would be nice.

When I get stressed I knit and crotchet because it is something my mother taught me to help with my manual dexterity. It allows my brain to stop racing and allows stuff I learn to sink in. I have many items throught my case hats scarves and such now for my Cal. supreme court Case I am working on a tie with a 1.5 mm needle and #10 chrochet thread it is coming out nice.

So think about that also as a way to keep connected with your family.

I know I am a guy but it calms me and I keep my hands able to work on small delicate work like electronics and such.

I post this to calm the conversation down, and hope that you can get a crotchet hook and some yarn and make a scarf a K hook is 1.99 at walmart and a skein of yard is about 2.95.

You can find the stiches instructions on crotchet.com and try the scarf pattern.

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Hi everyone. First, thanks for your concern about everything. My grannie and grandad are holding up pretty well. (Me too) My grannie has been bowling a lot (Her favorite pastime) and my grandad stays watching old westerns on the couch and eating pork rines lol like always.

Today we got a letter from the state attorney general and the consumer financial protection bureau saying they were going to investigate the matter and they sent requests to OCWEN to investigate this matter. The state attorney general asked that we send in all of our documentation to the office for their review. (We sent in some info originally-the letters for Ocwen saying we hadnt made any payments and bank statements for just the first year showing that payments were made, we would have sent them all but it was over 600 pages.) We are now going to send all the bank statements on Monday to their office. The letter said they would investigate but resolution may require going to court but they would try to mitigate things from there end. Im going to try and scan submit to the board the letter we got. The CFPB said they sent a letter to Ocwen requesting additional information on our case. So it seems like it might be good news but I'm just waiting to see where it goes from here

Also we found a few attorneys who wanted to meet with us! Yay! We have a consultation with the first 1 this coming week on Thursday. Wish us luck!

Just random related info: During this ordeal I'm also trying to get my personal credit together and you guys would not believe how amazingly helpful you all on the boards have been with both this issue with my grannies mortgage and my own credit questions, so thank you so much! :D

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gwheelock915, I am so sorry that happened to you! That's awful. it's like you try and do the right thing and be responsible and take care of your bills and it doesnt even matter! And these banks and servicers can do whatever they want because they have all the time and money in the world to give you the run around. It is so stressful. Just know you are not alone and I'm sure there are so many others like us. Please keep us posted on how things are going with you.

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Thanks everyone for your input, we are looking for a lawyer now and I think you guys are right we need to find one that specializes in mortgage fraud and foreclosures. My grandmother has a few mortgage statements from Chase showing the account was current (she didn't keep them all she just has a few showing spread out over the years but they all show the mortgage account was up to date as late as June 2008). We haven't gotten anything from Chase except letters saying they were changing our servicer for years. My grandmother says Real Time Resolutions never sent her anything but I think she just doesn't know what she did with mortgage statements from them or maybe she just through them out. She did keep all her bank statements and they show all the payments to Real Time Resolutions though. So she has mortgage statements from Chase Bank and Ocwen but we can't find anything but the original statement from Real Time Resolutions (which shows the account was up to date when they got servicing rights). Seadragon, we filed complaints with the CFPB, the FTC and the attorney general in the state yesterday. Is there anyone else we should send a complaint to? I think we will try the RESPA letter. Thanks again everyone! Ill keep updating as things happen and maybe my story will help others.

Here in CA we have California Residential Mortgage Lending act which has a state agency attached for complaints. I think your state would have one also. That is a good one and the media

The fact that they tried this is proof they are doing it to others. Such actions can only come from directions from upper level management and the changing of documents is very troubling because the courts put so much emphasis about banks mortgage documents and now they have forged ones. what are they using to make these documents and it has to be thousands of employees breaking the law. Forgery and false documents are federal crimes. I hope this turns into a case that makes fox news and the others so that others can come forward also.

I hope that you also work on the other things and any help just ask. and if you need to serve OCWEN which I believe is near me I would be honored to.

Edited by Seadragon

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Hi guys, I just wanted to keep updating with info and letting people know what was happening with us. First, I wish I could share some of the actual documents with you guys rather than me trying to type them up so you can see what these differnet entities are saying themselves. But I don't want to post our personal info (bank statements, account info, addresses, etc.) I've PDF'd all the letters we have gotten from everyone so if anyone knows a good way to black stuff out let me know so I can post stuff. Also let me know what would be good to post that you guys would want to see. I want to open because I really believe that whatever the outcome of this for me and my grandparents, the info will help someone else. But anywho here are some updates.

Update 1: Real Time Resolutions (The servicer that had our mortgage before Ocwen) has not responded to us AT ALL. No responses to our letters asking for statements, no return phone calls, nothing. We just figured since they arent making any money off us anymore then they dont care and we cant find anything that says they have to respond to us so thats that for now.

Update 2: We talked to 2 different lawyers who said our case is great (great documentation to prove our claim) but we weren’t the only ones! Can you believe that?! They both said over the past year they had seen a huge increase in people coming in their office with similar stories and frankly while these cases would be a slam dunk, logistically speaking, they would be a nightmare. The first lawyer said these big banks tend to just bury people until they give up and since they arent suing (yet I guess) to just keep disputing, keep collecting good records and let them initial any legal suits. We have a better chance of winning if the bank has a bad lawsuit and we some really good responses and a good chance of beating them back and getting a nice counterclaim. The second lawyer said something similar but also said since the value of the house is so low (little less than 30K) and the mortgage still has $50K+ owing on it down from an amount owed $70K when they got the mortgage they probably wont both much with it especially since we have been fighting them. She said the banks want house they can either break even or turn a profit on or at least aren’t costing them money so just keep disputing and leave it alone. A little bit depressed with these responses but it is what I get.

Update 3: After the talk with the attorneys, my grannie didn’t want to send our story to a news outlet. She said she would be willing if it escalated anymore but right now just “let it be baby don’t poke a bear unless you got your running shoes on” her words lol…grannies.

Update 4: Ocwen responded to our CFPB complaint. I will copy and past their insane response below.

The Office of the Consumer Ombudsman for Ocwen Loan Servicing, LLC (Ocwen) would like to take this opportunity to respond to your recent concern regarding the referenced loan. The Consumer Ombudsman was created to provide Ocwen’s customers with a resource to assist with unresolved concerns and issues. Ocwen's records indicate that the loan originated with Chase Financial Services, LLC on July 16 2004. when you purchased the above referenced collateral property. On July 12, 2012, the servicing rights of the loan were transferred to Ocwen with the loan past due for July 01, 2008 contractual payment. As Ocwen was not involved in the origination of the loan it would not be able to comment on concerns regarding the origination of the loan. Ocwen is obligated to service the loan according to the terms and conditions of the original Note and Mortgage, copies of which are enclosed for your review. However, by signing the documents, you clearly agreed to the terms and conditions thereof. On June 13, 2012 a Notice Of Assignment, Sale Or Transfer Of Servicing Rights, confirming that Ocwen would be servicing the loan was mailed to the property address at XXXXXX. The Notice, a copy of which is enclosed, included information such as Ocwen's payment mailing address and its Customer Relation Departments toll free number. Your correspondence is disputing the balance and due date transferred to Ocwen. We have enclosed for your convenience a copy of the Chase and Ocwen payment histories which detail all the payments received and applied to the loan. As of the date of this correspondence, XXXXXXX, the loan is due for the January 01, 2009 payment. The following items are enclosed: - Copies of the original Mortgage and Note. - Ocwen Payment Reconciliation History, Chase Payment History. The additional information you requested is not required to be provided and is not included. Should you have a particular dispute specifically related to one of the items not included, you may send us a written statement of the reasons you believe the information related to the loan servicing in relation to the item is incorrect. The remainder of your requests do not pertain to servicing and do not identify any dispute regarding servicing. Ocwen is the servicer and under RESPA a QWR must pertain to servicing as defined by RESPA. Therefore, your other requests do not qualify as a QWR and no response is required, nor is a response possible to many of the requests as Ocwen did not underwrite, originate or close the Loan.

I don’t even know what to say to that. the CFPB gave me the option to dispute that response so I did. They sent us a copy of our mortgage and the agreed payment note (don’t know why we werent disputing that just that we made our payments this whole time). The other thing they sent was what they define as chase and ocwen payment reconciliation history which was essentially just a couple of spreadsheets with a bunch of columns, amounts dates, its got lots of columns and super confusing.

Ill update a little more in a new response.

xdancex

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Update 5: Chase assigned us an account manager just for our loan and said to call him if we need help getting to the bottom of this. We call literally everyday and leave messages and he has never answered nor returned our calls. His voicemail says "I always responded within 24 business hours (which is a like 3 week days)" but we have been calling for almost 2 weeks and nothing. *sign*

Update 6: This one is the newest thing, yesterday we got a letter from chase that was just one page. It said the following (Ill paraphrase it)

In response to the RESPA letter we received, here is the loan transaction history (another spreadsheet similar to the one we got through the CFPB), your note (original payment note) and security instruments (couldnt even tell you what this bunch of documents in legalese)

Please contact our recovery dept so we can discuss the status of this loan. According to our records, this account was charged off October 2011. (???)

The investor of this loan is Deutsche bank.

Chase contact info.

I also did a little research on mortgage charge-offs and says this only happens when no payments are made (WTF!?!?). No one told us about a charge off and again we have the bank statements showing all the payments were made! how can they do this. It also says this typically happens on second mortgages not first and only. This is their first and only mortgage. Thanks for listening.

That's all for now...will update again soon. Reply with questions, comments! They are all welcome. :)++

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Did you ever get an attorney - as it is right now, you granny could get some serious $$$ - maybe even get the mortgage cancelled.

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No, we didnt hire an attorney. The least either of the 2 attorney's wanted to get started was $1200 but both of them advised that we not be the one to start the legal proceeding against either Chase or Ocwen. They said let them start the proceedings if they are going to do it because whichever way it goes its likely to be a long fight and if Chase nor Ocwen has started the fight, that might be a sign they dont want the fight. I think we could get the money together if necessary but I guess for now we are going to just keep sending in our documentation and trying to get it straightened out.

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Does anyone reading this know what it means when a mortgage is charged off? I know what it means when a credit card is charged off but how is a mortgage charged off?

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I don't think refinancing is a wise option at this point.

Let's assume the refinance is approved - Ocwen will simply issue a payoff letter demanding the disputed amount - all $20,000 or $30,000 whatever amount they like at the moment - and they will get it - then grandma has to chase them down - at her expense - to get it back.

I would simply tell Ocwen that the account is current and they are free to try to prove to a Judge otherwise, as you have the proof that it is current - all 300 pages of it.

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I don't think refinancing is a wise option at this point.

Let's assume the refinance is approved - Ocwen will simply issue a payoff letter demanding the disputed amount - all $20,000 or $30,000 whatever amount they like at the moment - and they will get it - then grandma has to chase them down - at her expense - to get it back.

I would simply tell Ocwen that the account is current and they are free to try to prove to a Judge otherwise, as you have the proof that it is current - all 300 pages of it.

I would agree and tell them that they are conducting illegal debt collection as the loan is current and you have every single paper to prove it and if they continue it would be harrassment. Also tell them where is the RESPA response?

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Bumping this thread: Just found out Ocwen is taking over my current mortgage. Googling Ocwen shows nothing but horror stories about them. Wondering how the OP has made out.

 

Once I get the paperwork confirming the transfer and my first statement, I'm refinancing away from them.

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Hi everyone, I wanted to provide you guys with an update on what is happening with my horror story in case anyone is still interested. Let me preface this by saying I am NOT named on the mortgage, this is my grandparents mortgage on their house, someone messaged me and asked why I didnt just go to court and the answer is 1) attorneys have seemed leary about fighting either ocwen and chase since they aren't threatening foreclosure and they could just bury us in ligitation forever and 2) I am not on the mortgage so anything that happens my grandparents have to agree to.

 

Essentially, this ain't over. Chase has finally gotten involved a little but they havent really helped. They forwarded us and Ocwen a statement letter showing that they did, in fact, transfer the servicing rights to Real Time Resolutions in 2009 before they gave it to Ocwen in 2012. Unfortunately, the status of real time resolutions is unknown. No responses from real time to any of our letters and their website is a barren wasteland of nothingness so we think they probably arent in business anymore. But we feel like coupled with the years of bank statements showing all the payments were made in full and on time and the letter from Chase indicating that Real Time had the servicing rights from 2009 to mid-2012 before it was passed to Ocwen we have an iron clad case to show that Ocwen and Chase are fradualently handling the mortgage. Now the impossible part, convincing my grandparents to take Chase and Ocwen to court. They have no interest whatsoever in going to court. They feel like "hey they are not trying to foreclose, let's keep doing what we are doing" However, I should also state they are paying $800/month right now for their mortgage. They only owe $420/month based on their mortgage note. The payments are higher because Ocwen upped their payments to collect the "unpaid balance" They are losing on almost $400/month to fradualent reporting. Both of them are retired and if they had that extra almost $400 a month they could live very comfortably. Even more important, that is their money not ocwen's. However, they don't want to pay less because they are afraid Ocwen will push them into foreclosure proceedings if they just pay the $420/month. 

 

It's incredibly frustrating that my grandparents don't want to fight them but I am working on convincing them that suing ocwen and Chase for mishandling their mortgage is the right thing to do. And God forgive me but if i had any legal power whatsoever, I would MAKE them go to court over this insanity. It is horrific what Ocwen is doing and what Chase is condoning and who knows how many people are overpaying, being foreclosed on, leaving their home because of poorly handled mortgages. Ill keep updating. I hope my story helps others and if ANYONE and i mean ANYONE wants to ask me question or if there is any information I can provide to help someone else with Ocwen. Inbox me

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