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RANT. POS Consumer attorney tells me to pay my lawsuit.


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So I was taking Art's advice and seeing about filing suit for an FDCPA violation against LVNV..  The closest  consumer attorney is 300 miles away, but has a "free" consult.  So I email him about my violation, and he calls me.  I tell him I have the creditors letter that states how much I owe, and then I have the suit that was brought against me for the actual amount of the charge off.  The dunning letter was for more. He tells me I can't file because they would just bring up the argument I only did it because they sued me.  He said I should have filed a cross complaint, but even then I probably wouldn't win. He says "you should probbably just pay the debt" Then he asked me for how much the suit was, and I told him 540 something. He says, you are going to lose in court, you should just pay it and be done with it.  He didn't even know the particulars of the case.  Never mind the fact I think I already paid it once, and just am such a horrible record keeper (I shred everything, don't worry, not anymore)  He treated me like I was some dumb bimbo that only wants to get out of paying her bills.  No dipsh**, if that were the case, I would have not done the right thing on 4 other cases and settled, costing me 10 grand.  (I know it wasn't the right thing now, because I didn't owe the scum bag CA's, I owed the cc companies)  Anyway, Now I am second guessing myself, and think I will lose this pittance of a case, and end up paying 3x the amount in attorney fees.  Someone tell me it's worth going the distance lol. grrr, bad day at work and then this guy, I am NOT in a good mood. He is supposed to be on my side.  I guess that is only if there is a BIG pay day for him.

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lol no the print is so small I need a magnifying glass to read it. I may have to go buy one. ;-)  I am waiting for their disclosures.  Judge denied discovery (yes this is county court, not small claims) and only ordered disclosure.  Day 3 of 10 for them to send theirs to me. Court date--may 14

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Don't let the advice of one "attorney" get you down. Most attorneys on every level strive for settling things out of court. A lot of them are just out there for the easy money and are not into litigation. That is why so many of us go Pro Se when fighting JDBs. You only want to talk to attorneys that have a proven track record of fighting.

 

Where did you find this one? Was this an attorney that specializes in FDCPA cases? A lot of the others are useless. We have some great ones that post here, but unfortunately none from Colorado. I am lucky that we have two from Tennessee here. (Nascar & TNConsumerLaw) 

 

That is why I wrote "That is why you need to talk with a consumer attorney that specializes in FDCPA cases."

 

Don't let one lazy attorney effect your motivation. Keep looking! :boxing:

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 He says "you should probbably just pay the debt" Then he asked me for how much the suit was, and I told him 540 something. He says, you are going to lose in court, you should just pay it and be done with it.  He didn't even know the particulars of the case.   I guess that is only if there is a BIG pay day for him.

 

These few words say it all about this guy. He heard 540. and thought "I can't make any money here". Even if a good attorney turned you down they would need to know the details of your case.

 

A good FDCPA attorney will not worry about your money. If they think you have a good case they will take it and let the other side pay their fees. In an average FDCPA case the attorney will get at least a couple thousand and that is one that settles fairly easy. On the rare occasion that the case lingers on they can make many times that if they win.

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misrepresenting the debt.  They said I owed 680 in the dunning letter, wouldnt provide DV when I asked.  Contacted (called) me again 3 months later, but not as "viking client services" for LVNV, but as LVNV.  Actual suit was 540 6 months later.

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Guest usctrojanalum

yeah, that's not a violation. unfortunately the attorney was right... did someone on this board tell you it was a violation???

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yeah, that's not a violation. unfortunately the attorney was right... did someone on this board tell you it was a violation???

 

I suggested she speak with an attorney that specializes in FDCPA cases to see if she has a case. I also suggested she take any letters and court papers to see if they could find other violations. She called this guy to ask these questions and he suggested she just pay the debt on her current case. The advice he gave her was not even relevant to why she called and anyone who makes a decision on the phone should not be trusted anyway.

 

While I didn't say this was a clear violation I have had success on cases with changing balances from letter to letter. I know of many others who have had success with this strategy also. 

 

15 U.S.C. 1692e(2) 

e. A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt.

2. The false representation of—

    a. the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or

    b. any services rendered or compensation which may be lawfully received by any debt collector for the collection of a debt.

 

This can be very confusing to the least sophisticated consumer when a balance changes with varying interest rates that were never even charged on the original alleged debt. Not to mention her balance went down, which is even more confusing to the least sophisticated consumer. 

 

Others have also been successful when the attorney adds fees to the amount on the summons instead of waiting to do so if they win. 

I know laws vary from state to state and opinions vary from circuit to circuit, but it never hurts to investigate you options. The first time I got involved in an FDCPA case I showed the attorney two violations I had documented and he found three others by just reviewing my papers.

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lol no the print is so small I need a magnifying glass to read it. I may have to go buy one.

 

So was mine.  I didn't have  a magnifying glass, but I have a scanner.  I zoomed the Arb Clause portion and made a very decent copy that I handed the judge during my MTC Arb hearing.  This worked very nicely.

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Guest usctrojanalum

I suggested she speak with an attorney that specializes in FDCPA cases to see if she has a case. I also suggested she take any letters and court papers to see if they could find other violations. She called this guy to ask these questions and he suggested she just pay the debt on her current case. The advice he gave her was not even relevant to why she called and anyone who makes a decision on the phone should not be trusted anyway.

 

While I didn't say this was a clear violation I have had success on cases with changing balances from letter to letter. I know of many others who have had success with this strategy also. 

 

15 U.S.C. 1692e(2) 

e. A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt.

2. The false representation of—

    a. the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or

    b. any services rendered or compensation which may be lawfully received by any debt collector for the collection of a debt.

 

This can be very confusing to the least sophisticated consumer when a balance changes with varying interest rates that were never even charged on the original alleged debt. Not to mention her balance went down, which is even more confusing to the least sophisticated consumer. 

 

Others have also been successful when the attorney adds fees to the amount on the summons instead of waiting to do so if they win. 

I know laws vary from state to state and opinions vary from circuit to circuit, but it never hurts to investigate you options. The first time I got involved in an FDCPA case I showed the attorney two violations I had documented and he found three others by just reviewing my papers.

 

I agree different balances from letter to letter are confusing and most of the time if the interest is still accruing (there is no reason it should not be) being applied correctly, the balance should change every single letter the defendant gets.

 

That being said, I'm not really sure how anyone could credibly argue that there is an FDCPA violation when the balance change actually benefits the consumer and decreases.  It could also be explained away as a typographical error, which is a valid defense.

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Guest usctrojanalum

Also, with the recent SCOTUS ruling that FDCPA defendants can be awarded costs if they prevail in a case whether or not the action was frivolous or brought in bad faith, we no longer have the luxury of suing debt collectors on borderline cases where we might be 50/50 to win or the violation is not that clear, because now they could actually make money off you suing them over an FDCPA violation... where in the past it was almost impossible.

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I agree different balances from letter to letter are confusing and most of the time if the interest is still accruing (there is no reason it should not be) being applied correctly, the balance should change every single letter the defendant gets.

 

That being said, I'm not really sure how anyone could credibly argue that there is an FDCPA violation when the balance change actually benefits the consumer and decreases.  It could also be explained away as a typographical error, which is a valid defense.

 

All I was suggesting was that she discuss that and let the attorney look for other possible violations in her dunning letter and court papers. Still Today not all collectors use the proper disclosures, safe harbor statements and proper placement of other items in their dunning letters. It never hurts to let a professional look over these things. Many of them are vague and open to judicial interpretation. 

 

I still know of cases where changing balances due to interest and fees still get settlements. A lot of these are added inconsistently and they have to prove they have the authority to do this.  It does vary from circuit to circuit, but most of these collectors do not want their entire business model exposed because of a small number of FDCPA lawsuits. They will say they have the legal authority to so when sued. So you then ask for proof that they have such legal authority. A lot of them, but not all, respond the same way they do when asked to prove standing when they are suing someone in a local case. The response is silence. The end.

 

I would never suggest anyone file a case that they didn't have a good chance of winning. That is why I always recommend someone use an attorney with FDCPA experience. As for the SCOTUS ruling I think it dealt with cost and not attorney fees. The attorney fees are probably 95%+ of the cost in these cases, and they are not awarded unless the case was proven to be brought in bad faith. 

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...

He says, you are going to lose in court, you should just pay it and be done with it.

...

He is supposed to be on my side.  I guess that is only if there is a BIG pay day for him.

Attorneys tend to amuse me unless they are representing someone suing me and then they mostly annoy me. At that point it is my job to provide ample opportunity for them and their client to pay for such annoyance.

 

The attorney is not on your side. He/she will respect the court 1st and their wallet 2nd. If the court tells them to throw their client under the bus a typical consumer attorney (like any other attorney) will say, "which side of the bus?" Consumers are a possible source of revenue and if it looks like a particular case might involve actual work they won't take the case on contingency and will likely suggest that the consumer can't win or it will be hard to win.

 

On occasion I will consult an attorney when I want free advice on where the weaknesses might be in my case. From my experience I have rarely found them qualified to determine whether or not my case has merit for filing suit.

 

When thinking of filing suit it is YOUR case not your attorney's case. You are responsible to determine if it has merit and is worth pursuing. IMO

 

I would probably consult a couple of more attorneys before I made my decision to pursue or not to pursue.

 

I don't chase losing propositions and I also don't believe anything spoken by an attorney not backed up by clearly supportive case law. Both have served me well.

 

What I learned from Marx v. GENERAL REVENUE CORPORATION, No. 11-1175 (U.S. Feb. 26, 2013): Do not lose. Bring a well evidenced case proving all required elements for each cause of action claimed and also seriously consider the whole picture when accepting or rejecting any Rule 68 Offers of Judgment. From my limited review it is not clear that Olivea Marx did either.

 

Avoiding the filing of frivolous/bad faith suits is a given in my book. Bringing weak or likely to lose suits just because they are non-frivolous/non-bad faith doesn't make sense to me.

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That may or may not be a good thing . . .

 

When people in another state are looking for an attorney for an FDCPA case I suggest they first go here.

 http://dockets.justia.com/

They can look up the cases against the JDB/CA that they are dealing with or the other usual suspects. Then look at the name of the plaintiff's attorneys.

Then go here and look up the same cases.

http://www.rfcexpress.com/

Find out the ones with the most settlements. 

 

It can be very time consuming, but if you don't have a good attorney or someone who can refer you to one its worth the effort.

The only drawback to this is you can't find the ones who settle before filing suit.

 

The easiest way is to get a referral here, but we only have a handful of states with attorneys who post here. 

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Also, with the recent SCOTUS ruling that FDCPA defendants can be awarded costs if they prevail in a case whether or not the action was frivolous or brought in bad faith, we no longer have the luxury of suing debt collectors on borderline cases where we might be 50/50 to win or the violation is not that clear, because now they could actually make money off you suing them over an FDCPA violation... where in the past it was almost impossible.

You can blame "whore" attorneys that will take any case - Dan Edelman from years ago is one example of many - for this.  This ruling has had a chilling effect with consumer attorneys to the extent that they charge upfront fees and have indemnification clauses in the Fee Agreements wherein if the client lies to the Attorney, they're on the hook for the fees assessed.

 

The TCPA is now the hot buttom cause of action because it does not yet have reverse idemnification and is still strict liability (more or less).

 

In any event, people need to realize that attorneys - themselves - take a significant risk in every case they take.  Malpractice, risk of losing, risk of not getting paid, risk of spending more than settlement or jury verdict, a hell of a lot of work for little money, etc.  While skilled consumer attorney's have "most" things down to a science with each potential party, risk is still involved and contrary to popular belief, consumer attorney's are typically not wealthy due to the amount of work involved (volume) and unforeseen twists.

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Attorneys tend to amuse me unless they are representing someone suing me and then they mostly annoy me. At that point it is my job to provide ample opportunity for them and their client to pay for such annoyance.

 

The attorney is not on your side. He/she will respect the court 1st and their wallet 2nd. If the court tells them to throw their client under the bus a typical consumer attorney (like any other attorney) will say, "which side of the bus?" Consumers are a possible source of revenue and if it looks like a particular case might involve actual work they won't take the case on contingency and will likely suggest that the consumer can't win or it will be hard to win.

 

On occasion I will consult an attorney when I want free advice on where the weaknesses might be in my case. From my experience I have rarely found them qualified to determine whether or not my case has merit for filing suit.

 

When thinking of filing suit it is YOUR case not your attorney's case. You are responsible to determine if it has merit and is worth pursuing. IMO

 

I would probably consult a couple of more attorneys before I made my decision to pursue or not to pursue.

 

I don't chase losing propositions and I also don't believe anything spoken by an attorney not backed up by clearly supportive case law. Both have served me well.

 

What I learned from Marx v. GENERAL REVENUE CORPORATION, No. 11-1175 (U.S. Feb. 26, 2013): Do not lose. Bring a well evidenced case proving all required elements for each cause of action claimed and also seriously consider the whole picture when accepting or rejecting any Rule 68 Offers of Judgment. From my limited review it is not clear that Olivea Marx did either.

 

Avoiding the filing of frivolous/bad faith suits is a given in my book. Bringing weak or likely to lose suits just because they are non-frivolous/non-bad faith doesn't make sense to me.

WOW!

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That may or may not be a good thing . . .

 

This is true.  The OP should get a variety of opinions just as a patient seeking a surgeon should get a variety of opinions.  I don't have any inside info on Larson, but I did note on his website that he has provided links to 25 cases he has won.  I have a particular interest in 1692d(6) cases, and I saw where he won SJ in "Doshay v. Global Credit Collections."

 

In my own case (which I won), I consulted with 6 attys. Five of them either ignored my email or told me I didn't have a valid claim.

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When people in another state are looking for an attorney for an FDCPA case I suggest they first go here.

 http://dockets.justia.com/

They can look up the cases against the JDB/CA that they are dealing with or the other usual suspects. Then look at the name of the plaintiff's attorneys.

Then go here and look up the same cases.

http://www.rfcexpress.com/

Find out the ones with the most settlements. 

 

It can be very time consuming, but if you don't have a good attorney or someone who can refer you to one its worth the effort.

The only drawback to this is you can't find the ones who settle before filing suit.

 

The easiest way is to get a referral here, but we only have a handful of states with attorneys who post here. 

I know attorney's in Colorado thanks to my cases with CACH, LLC here in Tennessee in USDC and state level courts.  Don't mess with NACA, it's largely a joke.  You need contacts to regional and in-house counsel.  Moreover, the best attorney's are the ones - gasp - that don't have you set a foot in a courtroom.

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This is true.  The OP should get a variety of opinions just as a patient seeking a surgeon should get a variety of opinions.  I don't have any inside info on Larson, but I did note on his website that he has provided links to 25 cases he has won.  I have a particular interest in 1692d(6) cases, and I saw where he won SJ in "Doshay v. Global Credit Collections."

 

In my own case (which I won), I consulted with 6 attys. Five of them either ignored my email or told me I didn't have a valid claim.

John Watts is the best in Alabama.  Did you speak with him?

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