theuniverse

ARBITRATION has commenced with jams Need some help!

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Hi, I just received the commencement packet from JAMS I'm going for Arbitration with Discover Bank for a disputed amount of $3500, can somebody suggest what steps do I need to take now? can someone please tell me what should I include in my formal complaint? please be as detailed as possible. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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What state are you in?  What law firm is representing them?   Curious - about to file MTC against D for around a grand more than you.   I had heard they will fight to the bitter end with no regards to how much they are actually losing.     All the judgements the get must give them plenty to play with.

 

Good luck!

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What are the things you stated in your JAMS Demand?

 

Expand on them.

 

If there are FDCPA violations by CAs that they hired, go into detail. If there are amounts at dispute in the actual debt, go into detail. Did you get robo calls to a cell phone that was not a phone they had permission to call? OCs are not exempt from TCPA violations.

 

Have there been errors on our CRs, that you disputed and came back verified? Talk about the FCRA violations.

 

Have you needed to go to the doctor for the headaches, aches and pains caused by stress? Have you missed work d/t dealing with the stress and/or the paperwork of this case?

 

Have their attorneys participated in any of these causes? Add them (FAST) to the complaint--they can be added on the same JAMS arbitration.

 

Be sure to note the Consumer Rules do NOT give them the right to make you pay the arbitration causes if you lose. Have that stipulated, because, although it IS part of the Consumer Rules, just like in court, if you don't make sure that rule is enforced, the arbitrator probably won't, either.

 

JAMS also offers the opportunity to have an appeals within JAMS, and you can have a three arbitrator panel. I would push for that, too, if it's not already part of the credit agreement.

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Thanks for your replies guys I'm in New York. @Wins the Battle Can you tell me how do I make sure I don't give them the right to make me pay for the arbitration causes? should I include that in the Formal Complaint? can you please tell me how I could redact it? Thanks

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You should note in your formal complaint that you expect ALL of the Consumer Rules to be followed. 

 

When you have your first conference call, unless the contract itself states that Discover pays for the arb costs, you can expect that they'll want the loser to pay. At that point, you MUST speak up and note that Consumer Rules specifically forbid the arbitrator to make the consumer pay, should they rule against him/her.

 

IF you go all the way through the arb, it's not that likely that you will win, for the simple reason that Discover is paying the arbitrator.

 

If it were a giant debt, that might be an issue. But if you end up owning $4K, and they've paid $20K, that's not so bad, in the grand scheme of things.

 

If you lose in court (easier to do against an OC) then you would very likely get saddled with their court costs.

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@Wins the Battle

 

At that point, you MUST speak up and note that Consumer Rules specifically forbid the arbitrator to make the consumer pay, should they rule against him/her.

 

 

Which rule is that?

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You should note in your formal complaint that you expect ALL of the Consumer Rules to be followed. 

 

When you have your first conference call, unless the contract itself states that Discover pays for the arb costs, you can expect that they'll want the loser to pay. At that point, you MUST speak up and note that Consumer Rules specifically forbid the arbitrator to make the consumer pay, should they rule against him/her.

 

IF you go all the way through the arb, it's not that likely that you will win, for the simple reason that Discover is paying the arbitrator.

 

If it were a giant debt, that might be an issue. But if you end up owning $4K, and they've paid $20K, that's not so bad, in the grand scheme of things.

 

If you lose in court (easier to do against an OC) then you would very likely get saddled with their court costs.

@Wins the Battle thank you so much, just one last thing it's very simple, can you please tell me where should I include the Consumer rules adherence stipulation? Should I include that as one of my allegations? should I include that at the "Prayer for relief" part? or it doesn't really matter?

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@Wins the Battle Also can you please tell me where do I find the rule you mention about not making losing party pay for fees?

http://www.jamsadr.com/rules-streamlined-arbitration/#Rule26



Because I found something that says the opposite:

 

 

"( c ) The Parties are jointly and severally liable for the payment of JAMS Arbitration fees and Arbitrator compensation and expenses. In the event that one Party has paid more than its share of such fees, compensation and expenses, the Arbitrator may Award against any Party any such fees, compensation and expenses that such Party owes with respect to the Arbitration."
 

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It's in the JAMS consumer standards:

 

http://www.jamsadr.com/rules-consumer-minimum-standards/

 

7. With respect to the cost of the arbitration, when a consumer initiates arbitration against the company, the only fee required to be paid by the consumer is $250, which is approximately equivalent to current Court filing fees. All other costs must be borne by the company including any remaining JAMS Case Management Fee and all professional fees for the arbitrator's services. When the company is the claiming party initiating an arbitration against the consumer, the company will be required to pay all costs associated with the arbitration

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@nobk4me

 

7. With respect to the cost of the arbitration, when a consumer initiates arbitration against the company, the only fee required to be paid by the consumer is $250, which is approximately equivalent to current Court filing fees. All other costs must be borne by the company including any remaining JAMS Case Management Fee and all professional fees for the arbitrator's services. When the company is the claiming party initiating an arbitration against the consumer, the company will be required to pay all costs associated with the arbitration

 

 

 

That rule appears to be for initiating arbitration.  If the consumer initiates, he must pay $250.  If the company initiates, it must pay all costs. 

 

The rule does not necessarily mean that a cc company can't recoup their costs if they prevail.

 

The Streamlined Rules (claim under $250,000) contains the following:

 

(e) The Award of the Arbitrator may allocate Arbitration Fees and Arbitrator compensation and expenses unless such an allocation is expressly prohibited by the Parties’ agreement. (Such a prohibition may not limit the power of the Arbitrator to allocate Arbitration fees and Arbitrator compensation and expenses pursuant to Rule 26©.).

 

If a cc company did not have a chance of recovering their arbitration fees, they would never arbitrate.   This would especially be the case with lower balances or balances in which, after paying the fees,  they would only break even.  Why would they put themselves in that position when they don't have to include an arbitration provision at all?

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@nobk4me

 

That rule appears to be for initiating arbitration.  If the consumer initiates, he must pay $250.  If the company initiates, it must pay all costs. 

 

The rule does not necessarily mean that a cc company can't recoup their costs if they prevail.

 

The Streamlined Rules (claim under $250,000) contains the following:

 

(e) The Award of the Arbitrator may allocate Arbitration Fees and Arbitrator compensation and expenses unless such an allocation is expressly prohibited by the Parties’ agreement. (Such a prohibition may not limit the power of the Arbitrator to allocate Arbitration fees and Arbitrator compensation and expenses pursuant to Rule 26©.).

 

If a cc company did not have a chance of recovering their arbitration fees, they would never arbitrate.   This would especially be the case with lower balances or balances in which, after paying the fees,  they would only break even.  Why would they put themselves in that position when they don't have to include an arbitration provision at all?

What if they realize the debtor is insolvent and with a chance of filing for chapter 7 Bankruptcy? and eventhough they might get rewarded for all costs and fees they would probably never get that money from debtor. Discover is playing that game with me. the amount in dispute for my case is like $3100. I'm gonna make sure it costs them dearly to pursue me even if they get rewarded at the end, they'll never see a penny back of what they paid.

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@theuniverse

 

I was referring to the rules.

 

What they can be awarded and what they can actually recover are not necessarily the same.

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@BV80

 

JAMS consumer rules override streamlined rules.

 

"All other costs must be borne by the company" means exactly that, and consumers need to emphasize that while in arbitration.

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@nobk4me

 

They are minimum standards, not rules. 

 

JAMS will administer arbitrations pursuant to mandatory pre-dispute arbitration clauses between companies and consumers1 only if the contract arbitration clause and specified applicable rules comply with the following minimum standards of fairness.

 

That says that before JAMS will agree to arbitrate the dispute, the arbitration provision in an agreement must comply with the 10 listed standards.

 

From the consumer standards:

 

8.  In California, the arbitration provision may not require the consumer to pay the fees and costs incurred by the opposing party if the consumer does not prevail.

 

That indicates that consumers in other states could be required to pay fees and costs incurred by the party who does not prevail.

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@nobk4me

 

They are minimum standards, not rules. 

 

JAMS will administer arbitrations pursuant to mandatory pre-dispute arbitration clauses between companies and consumers1 only if the contract arbitration clause and specified applicable rules comply with the following minimum standards of fairness.

 

That says that before JAMS will agree to arbitrate the dispute, the arbitration provision in an agreement must comply with the 10 listed standards.

 

From the consumer standards:

 

8.  In California, the arbitration provision may not require the consumer to pay the fees and costs incurred by the opposing party if the consumer does not prevail.

 

That indicates that consumers in other states could be required to pay fees and costs incurred by the party who does not prevail.

 

All I can say is that it's been argued, apparently successfully, by consumers who post on the "other" forum, DB.

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@nobk4me

 

I'm not saying that a consumer will definitely HAVE to pay the arbitration if he loses.  But the arbitrator can choose whether or not to award them.

 

Here's a link to a speech from a JAMS arbitrator to the SC Bar Association.  One excerpt from page 15:

 

To prepare for an arbitration administered by JAMS between a company and a consumer, counsel and parties should carefully review the JAMS Policy on Consumer Arbitrations Pursuant to Pre-Dispute Clauses Minimum Standards of Procedural Fairness, www.jamsadr.com/rules-consumner-minimum-standards/ which must be followed if applicable, and JAMS Streamlined Arbitration Rules, www.jamsadr.com/rules-streamlined- arbitration/ which will likely be the applicable procedural rules.

 

 

Arbitrating a Consumer Case through JAMS, Start to Finish

 

http://www.scbar.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=Kvyd23kq7I4%3D&tabid=1127

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Hey guys I need some help, hopefully someone will enlighten me. A few days after I filed my complaint with JAMS I just got a letter from a new lawfirm saying they represent the other lawfirm that originally represents Discover in court, they claim that the lawfirm that represents Discover is not a party in the case, I'm going to oppose that. Now what I need to know is, I'm going to object so do I need to add this new lawfirm as a Respondent and serve the objection to the new lawfirm that sent me the letter? or Do I just Serve the objection to the original lawfirm that represents Discover? I originally filed the Arbitration just for Discover and the original lawfirm that represents Discover. But now I got this letter from a new lawfirm saying they represent the lawfirm that represents Discover. So who should I deal with?

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Any updates on your case theuniverse?

My case is still up in the air, last thing I received was a packet from JAMS telling me that an arbitrator has been appointed and that was about a month ago. I think the next thing would be JAMS billing the other party the retainer  fees so that a Tele conference can be scheduled.

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I've been away for a while.

 

The JAMS consumer standards are very clear. The consumer only pays at most $250. But as stated before, you have to enforce this provision or it may be waived.  The bank will try to make you pay, but arbitration is a contract. The contract is very clear. If the arbitrator violates that contract, he/she has exceeded their powers given by contract.

 

If you are curious to see who has paid what, you can download the quarterly disclosure document and review for yourself. http://www.jamsadr.com/consumer-arbitration-disclosures/

 

If you have FDCPA violations against the law firm, keep them in the party. They are likely covered under the arbitration agreement. Be prepared to inform the case manager that only the arbitrator can decide whether the arbitration clause applies to the law firm.

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I've been away for a while.

 

The JAMS consumer standards are very clear. The consumer only pays at most $250. But as stated before, you have to enforce this provision or it may be waived.  The bank will try to make you pay, but arbitration is a contract. The contract is very clear. If the arbitrator violates that contract, he/she has exceeded their powers given by contract.

 

If you are curious to see who has paid what, you can download the quarterly disclosure document and review for yourself. http://www.jamsadr.com/consumer-arbitration-disclosures/

 

If you have FDCPA violations against the law firm, keep them in the party. They are likely covered under the arbitration agreement. Be prepared to inform the case manager that only the arbitrator can decide whether the arbitration clause applies to the law firm.

Hey man, thanks for taking the time to reply. As of right now a teleconference has been scheduled for next week, and I would like to know if there's any tips that you can provide me as to how to handle that conference call?

Also, how should I base my argument objecting the other party making me responsible for attorney's and arbitration fees?

 

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Any updates theuniverse?

 

Yep, the attorneys from Discover offered me a mutual dismissal during the Teleconference call, I guess they realized I wasn't worth pursuing. Their claim was for $3800 against me. So, Arbitration does work!!

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@nobk4me

 

I'm not saying that a consumer will definitely HAVE to pay the arbitration if he loses.  But the arbitrator can choose whether or not to award them.

 

Here's a link to a speech from a JAMS arbitrator to the SC Bar Association.  One excerpt from page 15:

 

To prepare for an arbitration administered by JAMS between a company and a consumer, counsel and parties should carefully review the JAMS Policy on Consumer Arbitrations Pursuant to Pre-Dispute Clauses Minimum Standards of Procedural Fairness, www.jamsadr.com/rules-consumner-minimum-standards/ which must be followed if applicable, and JAMS Streamlined Arbitration Rules, www.jamsadr.com/rules-streamlined- arbitration/ which will likely be the applicable procedural rules.

 

 

Arbitrating a Consumer Case through JAMS, Start to Finish

 

http://www.scbar.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=Kvyd23kq7I4%3D&tabid=11

 

@BV80

 

I'm in the process of considering arbitration with JAMS. This is great info, very helpful! Thanks for posting the link.

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