fight2win

Won before, but here we go again....

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The numbers might be easier this way - the difference between what you owe and my hypothetical settlement is $400. The cost of losing on appeal could be ten times that amount. Ask for a commitment from those that disagree to cover your nut if things go south. Peace, out.

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@fight2win

 

I think it is apparent what your strategy is, you've been open about it.  If by chance no settlement comes, then *hopefully* you'll get passed the MSJ.  If not, you gave it your best shot, and that is more than 95% of the people in the same situation have done. 

 

It is a preponderance of "admissible" evidence that is required.  I suppose goody & harry have never seen a case where it hinged on a single piece of evidence, a Bill of Sale for example.  

 

 

@fight2win

 

No one is trying to tell you that you've lost.  What they're trying to do is show you how the JDB might respond to certain objections and/or how the judge might respond.  Having an idea of those possible responses can hopefully help you address those issues in your opposition.

 

The sources of confusion and negativity are highly counterproductive, and way off topic for what the OP is requesting.   Seems to be a common theme.

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@fight2win good luck Tuesday. I think your doing a great job to al least get a decent settlement. You had a question about since the affiant is in colorado, wouldn't they have to fly that person in? More likely than not they will motion for a testimony by phone. @Seadragon has a good az. Opposition if they should do that. If you are sussessful in opposing that motion, it puts them in a spot as to weather or not they would change it and actually fly them in.

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@fight2win good luck Tuesday. I think your doing a great job to al least get a decent settlement. You had a question about since the affiant is in colorado, wouldn't they have to fly that person in? More likely than not they will motion for a testimony by phone. @Seadragon has a good az. Opposition if they should do that. If you are sussessful in opposing that motion, it puts them in a spot as to weather or not they would change it and actually fly them in.

thanks :)

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Can I use the Plaintiff's answers to my Rogs as part of my Oppostion?  When asked to identify each person who has knowlege ...about this lawsuit, they did not include the name of the OC Affiant - wouldn't they need to include that?  

 

Also when asked what the Affiant used to verify the accuracy of the account, they didn't answer.  Wouldn't they need to know wether it's a computer screen, a document, etc.? 

 

If the Plaintiff claims that the info is accurate, the should know where the info came from.  I also asked in my Rogs and RFA's about the date of the Bill of Sale, and again, they responded with an objection.  Shouldn't they be able to explain and verify that transaction date?

 

Interrogatory No. 2:

 

Identify each person who has knowledge or claims to have knowledge of information or events related to this lawsuit.  For each such person, give their name, address, telephone number, and a summary of that person’s knowledge or involvement in this matter.

 

RESPONSE NO. 2: Objection, Plaintiff objects as this request is overly broad, unduly burdensome, vague, ambiguous, not limited in time or scope and ill-defined in its request for the identification of “all persons.”  Subject to and without waiving the foregoing objection, Plaintiff states:  the Defendant; any of Plaintiff’s authorized agents, including but not limited to the following:  Martie Wise, Vicky Icky, Chris Costly, Angel Miller, Anna Banana, and other authorized representative of CACH, LLC.  The above listed can be contacted c/o Law Office Of Joe Blow, address…..The above are expected to testify about the business procedures and about the business documents and records as held in the ordinary course of business concerning the account in question.

 

Interrogatory No. 18:

 

Does the Affiant use a computer to fill out Affidavits of Debt? How did the Affiant obtain the name and amount of debt allegedly owed by the Defendant?  Describe this process in detail.

 

RESPONSE NO. 18:  Plaintiff objects to this request as being overly broad, unduly burdensome, vague, ambiguous, unclear, not limited in time or scope and ill-defined in its request.  Plaintiff further objects as the request seeks to discover information about actions of a third party not a party to this action.  Further, Plaintiff objects to this request as the request is made with the intent to harass the Plaintiff as the request is not relevant and not reasonably calculated to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence as it relates to the Defendant’s liability for the debt that forms the basis of this action.

 

Interrogatory No. 16:

 

List all procedures that the Affiant used to verify the accuracy of the alleged debt owed to Issuer.  What documents were given to the Affiant for verification of this alleged debt? Were these same documents sent to the Defendant with the Complaint?

 

RESPONSE NO. 16:  Plaintiff objects to this request as being overly broad, unduly burdensome, vague, ambiguous, unclear, not limited in time or scope and ill-defined in its request.  Plaintiff further objects as the request seeks to discover information about actions of a third party not a party to this action.  Further, Plaintiff objects to this request as the request is made with the intent to harass the Plaintiff as the request is not relevant and not reasonably calculated to lead to the discovery of admissible evidence as it relates to the Defendant’s liability for the debt that forms the basis of this action.

 

 

Yes you can use their Rog responses against them. You can supply a copy as an exhibit in your opposition and cite them.

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What happens once a settlement is agreed to at pretrial?  There will still be a MSJ floating around the court.  I imagine we, jointly, file some of type of paper stating the terms of settlement, but is there anything specifically I need to do to?

 

Thanks 

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Settled this morning for $500, one payment, and dismissal with prejudice.  

 

Asking for help on a public forum where you need to post the details of your case, and then being told that the other side has already proven theirs is the equivalent of saying "you've ALREADY lost".  Any individual who feels the need to make that statement on here publicly is not trying to be of any help.

 

I am sure that the lurkers from the other side find it easy to get updates - if and when they want.  My amount was far less than others on this forum, and some people probably have a lot more riding on the outcome, so comments on here suggesting that someone truly owes a debt, or pointing out all the ways the other side is probably going to prevail would be better communicated through a PM (in my opinion).  I didn't feel that I had any leverage at pretrial thanks to much (not all) of the help on this forum. I am happy with the settlement, regardless.  

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Based on your last statements to me, I knew you would try to blame the outcome on me.

 

I don't know what you expected when you went in, but you settled a $1,000+ debt for $500.  You got out of having to pay over 1/2 of your debt.  You certainly never had that kind of bargaining power with the OC.

 

Had you ended up having to pay more than the amount of the actual debt, I could see you being angry with the outcome based on my input.  If you honestly think you came away with a raw deal, you have a distorted view of the world.

 

And you always had the option to continue fighting.  I don't know what you think I or anyone else said that could have tipped your hand to the other side, but they already know everything everyone says here.  They know your odds of winning are not good just like I do.

 

Truth be known, I would have liked to see you fight this out just to know if it's possible to win with the evidence they had.

 

Maybe next time.

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@fight2win I am glad you are happy with the settlement. It is true az. Laws are skewed in my opinion. It is a little tougher to beat the JDB in az because of their heresay rules, but that does not mean it can't be done. Someone from az once told me he never counts on fighting a suit the usual way by challenging standing (assuming the debt was legit with an OC, but rather he finds leverage. Weather it be a counter claim for perceived violations of collection laws, or arbitration, he finds it, and fights using that leverage in addition to any standing issues, amount of debt issues, etc. Sometimes he even admits the debt to the oc, but has some other form of leverage. He has beaten original creditors suits. So I guess part of this learning process is to find that leverage before an answer is filed, it is easier than having to go ammend, and start over. Congrats to you though, this one is over.

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Harry, no, I don't blame you in the least, or anyone for my outcome.  My outcome was good - which is why I said "I'm happy with my settlement".  In over 10+ years I've had less than $5K worth of debt - which some went into default when the economy tanked and my husband lost his job for a short period of time.  $500? How could I complain? 

 

What I was saying was that people come this forum for help.  Helping someone can very well come in the form of a reality check, and helping someone to see other possible outcomes.  For that, I thank you.  However, I started getting some help, and then when I was trying to apply that help to my back-up plan, it seemed that many of you started to tell my why I couldn't win in court, or an appeal (which was never my plan anyway).  I didn't know if the JDBA would accept a settlement because they already had a MSJ filed with the court, and I only had until the 1st to answer.  They had the advantage of knowing the judge, so in my mind, it was *possible* that they could tell me I needed to pay the full amount that they were asking, or they would just let the judge decide.  

 

I just wanted to feel  prepared to oppose their MSJ in case I needed to.  I didn't expect to pay less than $500, and was pleased that was all I had to pay. 

 

In the future, if the situation looks grim for a defendant, some comments would be better communicated privately.  That is just my opinion.   My "thank you", Harry, was genuine.

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It's OK to blame me, whether you are really happy with the outcome, or not. I'm only here to help the next guy.

You have some great information from fighting all of your "cases" - using an attorney.  However, pointing out publicly that the Plaintiff has proven their case might possibly be perceived in another way.  And FWIW - I hope you do help the next guy.   My outcome was good because I made the best choice for me.  

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Harry, no, I don't blame you in the least, or anyone for my outcome.

Then I don't understand what you mean by this:

I didn't feel that I had any leverage at pretrial thanks to much (not all) of the help on this forum.

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Your outcome was good because you took my advice and settled. The record is here for the next guy willing to learn.

 

Some will blame AZ law, others will hopefully take a little more. There are some good lessons in this thread.

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Based on your last statements to me, I knew you would try to blame the outcome on me.

 

I don't know what you expected when you went in, but you settled a $1,000+ debt for $500.  You got out of having to pay over 1/2 of your debt.  You certainly never had that kind of bargaining power with the OC.

 

Had you ended up having to pay more than the amount of the actual debt, I could see you being angry with the outcome based on my input.  If you honestly think you came away with a raw deal, you have a distorted view of the world.

 

And you always had the option to continue fighting.  I don't know what you think I or anyone else said that could have tipped your hand to the other side, but they already know everything everyone says here.  They know your odds of winning are not good just like I do.

 

Truth be known, I would have liked to see you fight this out just to know if it's possible to win with the evidence they had.

 

Maybe next time.

No next time for me!

 

It would have been nice to find out, but I decided not at the expense of my family.  If I was helping another person, I'd probably encourage them to settle unless that person had the funds and the time to fight.  This process is exhausting.  Forget a "pay for delete" - it's more like "pay for your sanity".  

 

And Harry, HONESTLY, anyone who comes here for help should never ever blame anyone for the outcome.  We all make our own bed.... If I had decided to fight and lost, and had I taken every ounce of advice that you had given, I would not have returned here bitter with you.  

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Then I don't understand what you mean by this:

I didn't know if JDB would settle. It might have made them more compelled to settle knowing that I had an Opposition prepared.  I didn't want to settle out of weakness and fear.  

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I'm very glad that this is over for you and that you're happy with the settlement.  Now that it's over, you can concentrate on your family without the cloud of a lawsuit hanging over your head.

 

Asking for help on a public forum where you need to post the details of your case, and then being told that the other side has already proven theirs is the equivalent of saying "you've ALREADY lost".  Any individual who feels the need to make that statement on here publicly is not trying to be of any help.

 

The above is an unfair judgment.  It's not the equivalent of "you've ALREADY lost".  It means "you have some research and work to do because you may have an uphill battle".  

People come here for information.  Unfortunately, some information might include facts that are not always positive for a defendant.  Some of the information may be "grim".  Failing to include unpopular or negative facts that are evident by law or court rulings is unfair.  To provide only cheerleading and the standard "the JDB's evidence and affidavit fail because..." without bothering to check to see if an OP's courts agree is both unfair and unhelpful.  This is a public forum and threads are available for all members or visitors to read.  To suggest that "grim" facts or information should only be included in a PM is of no help to future readers of a thread.

Some people actually prefer as much information as possible, both positive and negative, so that they can determine for themselves if they have the necessary time to invest in their own defense, should settle, or should hire an attorney.

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I'm very glad that this is over for you and that you're happy with the settlement.  Now that it's over, you can concentrate on your family without the cloud of a lawsuit hanging over your head.

 

The above is an unfair judgment.  It's not the equivalent of "you've ALREADY lost".  It means "you have some have some research and work to do because you may have an uphill battle".  

People come here for information.  Unfortunately, some information might include facts that are not always positive for a defendant.  Some of the information may be "grim".  Failing to include unpopular or negative facts that are evident by law or court rulings is unfair.  To provide only cheerleading and the standard "the JDB's evidence and affidavit fail because..." without bothering to check to see if an OP's courts agree is both unfair and unhelpful.  This is a public forum and threads are available for all members or visitors to read.  To suggest that "grim" facts or information should only be included in a PM is of no help to future readers of a thread.

Some people actually prefer as much information as possible, both positive and negative, so that they can determine for themselves if they have the necessary time to invest in their own defense, should settle, or should hire an attorney.

 

It is absolutely a fair judgment, and the negative "facts" as you call them are way off topic for what the OP (and others) are requesting.  Of course stating and/or implying that defendants fighting these case are criminals and deadbeat debtors, and everyone should just settle is not what I would call "helpful".  This is the same language everyone hears when they speak with a collection agency on the phone.  Curious.

 

We all know that being a defendant in these cases require onerous amounts of time and energy.  That being said, if someone wishes to defend themselves, and the appropriate caveats have been stated, then postings should be centered around what the OP has requested.  This endless droning, like a broken record is/was entirely confusing and frustrating.

 

Good job @fight2win, it takes a lot of determination to even begin to defend yourself.  The upside is you didn't have to pay an attorney $1000 to settle the case for you for $500.  

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You did a good job, and now it's all over.

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