NoMoCr*p

Need to settle debts with PRA, Cavalry, & others-Arbitration if nec?

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Due to hardships we ran up credit card debt and the ones we couldn't pay off when my husband retired are now coming back to bite us.

Most of the info in these forums are OLD.

We are already in SJ in 3 cases (and $3K in legal fees that we didn't have!) and making small monthly payments.

Cut to the chase:

I recently received 2 letters from PRA saying 2 different charged off  CC accounts "have been referred to the litigation department".  One is a second notice.

Now my husband went and sold his dream car this week so we can may be get these settled.  I tried to call hem this afternoon about 10 minutes before they closed but they were already closed of course.  

In my research I see these JDB's  are:

1) vultures;
2) in business to make a profit:
3) will sue for as little as $500
4) paid appx 8 cents on the dollar for this debt:
5) WILL sue if I can't get them to settle.

The accounts were all in my name.

SO I am going to call them and tell them the truth:

1) I have no regular reliable income (TRUE) or I would ave been able to pay this off (TRUE) and/or make arrangements before:
2) I live on my husband's fixed retirement income (TRUE);
3) I have a medical condition and physical limitations form that that make it hard for me to get a job now (TRUE);
4) I sold some things and borrowed a bit from a family member to raise some cash to see if we can put this issue to rest.

And offer them 16%.
Any help with verbiage will help.  I know I need to make them think I am not with pursuing.  Which I'm not.  I'd like to get this off my back but I will NOT give these crooks the full amount as THEY DID NOT PAY THE FULL AMOUNT.

(BTW SOL doesn't apply.  Last payments made on my CC's were Sept 2015.)

I need to also follow up in writing.  Where can I get some sample template letters for that?

Any tips? 

And if this fails and they still sue me, will asking for arbitration help?  Both accounts were with Synchrony bank, one about $3500 the other $6500.  There are posts in this forum about using this as defense but if they were losing cases by that method in 2010 I can bet they have changed the strategies or rules to favor the JDB's by now  (This is AZ after all!) 

Thanks!

 

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49 minutes ago, NoMoCr*p said:

In my research I see these JDB's  are:

1) vultures;
2) in business to make a profit:
3) will sue for as little as $500
4) paid appx 8 cents on the dollar for this debt:
5) WILL sue if I can't get them to settle.

The only buy bad debt portfolio because consumers default.  While some have circumstances that are hardships like yours many more simply live beyond their means then default on the debt.

The reality is as much as consumers loathe this practice if creditors could not sell their bad debts and recoup some of the loss most people would not qualify for credit to start with.

Basic contract law states that when a contract is assigned to a new owner they get all the rights and responsibilities of the original creditor so despite what they paid for the account they have the legal right to sue for the balance due on the account.

52 minutes ago, NoMoCr*p said:

SO I am going to call them and tell them the truth:

1) I have no regular reliable income (TRUE) or I would ave been able to pay this off (TRUE) and/or make arrangements before:
2) I live on my husband's fixed retirement income (TRUE);
3) I have a medical condition and physical limitations form that that make it hard for me to get a job now (TRUE);
4) I sold some things and borrowed a bit from a family member to raise some cash to see if we can put this issue to rest.

DO NOT call.  Anything said verbally is not enforceable. The major problem you have is Arizona is a community property state.  They can sue both of you and he can still be held responsible for the debt(s).  

WRITE if you want to offer a settlement.  Start with a number LESS than the maximum you can afford on each account and keep negotiating until you reach a number you can both live with.

55 minutes ago, NoMoCr*p said:

And if this fails and they still sue me, will asking for arbitration help?  Both accounts were with Synchrony bank, one about $3500 the other $6500. 

Yes.  Synchrony has the BEST arbitration agreement of all the cards out there.

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1 hour ago, NoMoCr*p said:

Most of the info in these forums are OLD.

Which information on this site are you referring to as “old”?

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1 hour ago, NoMoCr*p said:

And if this fails and they still sue me, will asking for arbitration help?  Both accounts were with Synchrony bank, one about $3500 the other $6500.  There are posts in this forum about using this as defense but if they were losing cases by that method in 2010 I can bet they have changed the strategies or rules to favor the JDB's by now  (This is AZ after all!)

I would say to wait until you are sued and use arbitration. We have seen recent several "wins" in Arizona, as the Statutes/Rules are very clear that if an agreement to arbitrate exists (and it does), then that is the preferred method of dispute resolution. We have seen debt buyers make every argument in the book to get out of arbitration, and they all get shot down. Once the judge orders arbitration, they will fold. Even if they someday decide to "make an example" of someone by engaging in arbitration, you are the last people they would bother with. It sounds like your only source of income might be exempt from garnishment and there's nothing else coming.

You you mentioned SJ - I assume that is for Summary Judgement - and legal fees. Did you hire a lawyer and still lose at Summary Judgement in those cases?

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2 hours ago, NoMoCr*p said:

We are already in SJ in 3 cases (and $3K in legal fees that we didn't have!) and making small monthly payments.

Can you clarify this?  Are you saying you already have judgments against you, or that you are currently in litigation and they have filed a motion for summary judgment?

2 hours ago, NoMoCr*p said:

1) vultures;
2) in business to make a profit:
3) will sue for as little as $500
4) paid appx 8 cents on the dollar for this debt:
5) WILL sue if I can't get them to settle.

None of these things have any relevance.  As to #2, are you aware of any business that would exist if they didn't make a profit?  Point is, what they do is 100% legal.  They buy accounts where the consumers have already agreed that the account may be sold at any time to anyone, including a debt buyer whose sole purpose is collecting the unpaid debt. (Read your card agreement.)

I'm not trying to upset your sensibilities. You need to get out of the mindset that you are up against 'despicable' business people.  Thinking that way clouds your vision for what you need to do, and doesn't help you at all because the court won't care.

2 hours ago, NoMoCr*p said:

SO I am going to call them and tell them the truth:

1) I have no regular reliable income (TRUE) or I would ave been able to pay this off (TRUE) and/or make arrangements before:
2) I live on my husband's fixed retirement income (TRUE);
3) I have a medical condition and physical limitations form that that make it hard for me to get a job now (TRUE);
4) I sold some things and borrowed a bit from a family member to raise some cash to see if we can put this issue to rest.

I agree with clydesmom on this one.  While your hardship situation may cause them to back off, their agents are very skilled at bending your words around and they will then have a recorded phone call with you admitting to who knows what.  I'm not sure about PRA, but some debt buyers have a 'consumer's bill of rights' kind of thing where they won't pursue collection of debts where the consumer is legitimately unable to pay due to fixed income or a disability.  You can make them aware of your situation in writing, and send it via certified mail so you have proof that they received your statement of circumstances.  At that point they will probably send you a financial statement to fill out and affidavit of inability to pay to sign.  Once you complete that to their satisfaction, they will close the case and that will be that. (<--- this assumes they have this kind of program.)

2 hours ago, NoMoCr*p said:

And if this fails and they still sue me, will asking for arbitration help?  Both accounts were with Synchrony bank, one about $3500 the other $6500.  There are posts in this forum about using this as defense but if they were losing cases by that method in 2010 I can bet they have changed the strategies or rules to favor the JDB's by now  (This is AZ after all!) 

The great news for you is that the Synchrony arbitration clause is your golden ticket here.  The agreement says they will pay all of your arbitration fees.  PRA will almost certainly walk away from these cases because of the cost to them.  After all, it's the only shot you really have if you end up getting sued because they will win in court.

(I'm not sure what you are referring to when you said people were loosing to arbitration in 2010, but the only "losses" I am aware of are cases where the consumer was sued by an original creditor.  Any time arbitration is used against a debt buyer, the debt buyer has walked away.)

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1 hour ago, NoMoCr*p said:

Most of the info in these forums are OLD.

I'd recommend searching the forums for Synchrony, PRA, and Calvary.  There are a lot of recent threads involving theses three.

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4 hours ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

I would say to wait until you are sued and use arbitration. We have seen recent several "wins" in Arizona, as the Statutes/Rules are very clear that if an agreement to arbitrate exists (and it does), then that is the preferred method of dispute resolution. We have seen debt buyers make every argument in the book to get out of arbitration, and they all get shot down. Once the judge orders arbitration, they will fold. Even if they someday decide to "make an example" of someone by engaging in arbitration, you are the last people they would bother with. It sounds like your only source of income might be exempt from garnishment and there's nothing else coming.

You you mentioned SJ - I assume that is for Summary Judgement - and legal fees. Did you hire a lawyer and still lose at Summary Judgement in those cases?

Stipulatory Judgement?  They have agreed to let us pay in monthly payments.  SMALL monthly payments.  Yes a lawyer responded for us.  We were going to file bankruptcy but changed our mind.
 

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4 hours ago, Harry Seaward said:

Can you clarify this?  Are you saying you already have judgments against you, or that you are currently in litigation and they have filed a motion for summary judgment?

None of these things have any relevance.  As to #2, are you aware of any business that would exist if they didn't make a profit?  Point is, what they do is 100% legal.  They buy accounts where the consumers have already agreed that the account may be sold at any time to anyone, including a debt buyer whose sole purpose is collecting the unpaid debt. (Read your card agreement.)

I'm not trying to upset your sensibilities. You need to get out of the mindset that you are up against 'despicable' business people.  Thinking that way clouds your vision for what you need to do, and doesn't help you at all because the court won't care.

I agree with clydesmom on this one.  While your hardship situation may cause them to back off, their agents are very skilled at bending your words around and they will then have a recorded phone call with you admitting to who knows what.  I'm not sure about PRA, but some debt buyers have a 'consumer's bill of rights' kind of thing where they won't pursue collection of debts where the consumer is legitimately unable to pay due to fixed income or a disability.  You can make them aware of your situation in writing, and send it via certified mail so you have proof that they received your statement of circumstances.  At that point they will probably send you a financial statement to fill out and affidavit of inability to pay to sign.  Once you complete that to their satisfaction, they will close the case and that will be that. (<--- this assumes they have this kind of program.)

The great news for you is that the Synchrony arbitration clause is your golden ticket here.  The agreement says they will pay all of your arbitration fees.  PRA will almost certainly walk away from these cases because of the cost to them.  After all, it's the only shot you really have if you end up getting sued because they will win in court.

(I'm not sure what you are referring to when you said people were loosing to arbitration in 2010, but the only "losses" I am aware of are cases where the consumer was sued by an original creditor.  Any time arbitration is used against a debt buyer, the debt buyer has walked away.)

The only mindset I have is that this is a business for profit and they have the ability to accept much less than than the full amount and still generate a profit.  

I didn't know what a junk debt buyer was util a few days ago.

4 hours ago, Goody_Ouchless said:
  I would say to wait until you are sued and use arbitration. We have seen recent several "wins" in Arizona, as the Statutes/Rules are very clear that if an agreement to arbitrate exists (and it does), then that is the preferred method of dispute resolution. We have seen debt buyers make every argument in the book to get out of arbitration, and they all get shot down. Once the judge orders arbitration, they will fold. Even if they someday decide to "make an example" of someone by engaging in arbitration, you are the last people they would bother with. It sounds like your only source of income might be exempt from garnishment and there's nothing else coming.

Thank you this is good news.  I hope we can get a settlement and avoid court.  I can pay 16% in a lump sum; but I don't want to go higher than 25%. 

We'd like to get this behind us.
 

4 hours ago, BV80 said:

Which information on this site are you referring to as “old”?

I had not seen any recent posts regarding some of this most were more than 3 years old, most of the ones I saw were 2008-2010.  Things change.  I want to make sure that this tactic still works here in AZ.  
 
PRA had a HUGE judgement against them in the fall of 2015 .  I'll bet they are not making the same mistakes.  Just saying.

5 hours ago, Clydesmom said:

The only buy bad debt portfolio because consumers default.  While some have circumstances that are hardships like yours many more simply live beyond their means then default on the debt.

The reality is as much as consumers loathe this practice if creditors could not sell their bad debts and recoup some of the loss most people would not qualify for credit to start with.

Basic contract law states that when a contract is assigned to a new owner they get all the rights and responsibilities of the original creditor so despite what they paid for the account they have the legal right to sue for the balance due on the account.

DO NOT call.  Anything said verbally is not enforceable. The major problem you have is Arizona is a community property state.  They can sue both of you and he can still be held responsible for the debt(s).  

WRITE if you want to offer a settlement.  Start with a number LESS than the maximum you can afford on each account and keep negotiating until you reach a number you can both live with.

Yes.  Synchrony has the BEST arbitration agreement of all the cards out there.

Thanks for your help!

 

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7 hours ago, NoMoCr*p said:

There are posts in this forum about using this as defense but if they were losing cases by that method in 2010 I can bet they have changed the strategies or rules to favor the JDB's by now  (This is AZ after all!) 

https://www.creditinfocenter.com/community/topic/329407-arbitration-in-the-modern-era/

https://www.creditinfocenter.com/community/topic/329436-arbitration-overview-and-strategy-2018-most-up-to-date-info/

 

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With the combination of PRA and a Synchrony Bank Card Agreement, I personally would use arbitration 100% of the time and expect a $0 walk away.

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