CA County District Attorney collecting on a Bad Check

[Cliff2009]

A friend bounced a large check to a mechanic (over $2k), he had moved due to a divorce and the mail was not forwarded. Now the DA office (I assume a collection firm which are able to use their letterhead) sent a ":RE Notice of pending arrest and warrant".

He called and they demanded payment in full or a warrant would be issued. He was able to delay a little but he is rather worried. 

Is the option of DV on the table? All they sent was a letter with the amount listed and Payee. 

Any advice is appriciated. 

 

[Clydesmom]

37 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

A friend bounced a large check to a mechanic (over $2k), he had moved due to a divorce and the mail was not forwarded.

This one calls for tough love.  BS.  He had to have known writing a check that large whether the funds were there.  If he is using the bank account he also had to know it was not paid.  He also knows to make arrangements to have his mail forwarded from the PO and not his ex.  How long ago did he write this check?

38 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

Now the DA office (I assume a collection firm which are able to use their letterhead) sent a ":RE Notice of pending arrest and warrant".

It is possible it is a collection agency that has contracted to use the DA letter head as it does happen.  HOWEVER, I would not assume it is.  The problem with this situation and DV is if it really is the DA they are not subject to the FDCPA and could simply file a warrant for his arrest as this is a criminal matter.

39 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

He called and they demanded payment in full or a warrant would be issued. He was able to delay a little but he is rather worried. 

Is the number in the letter actually to the DA?  If so he should be worried.  This is a third degree felony due to the amount.

76-6-505.  Issuing a bad check or draft -- Presumption. 

(1)

(a)Any person who issues or passes a check or draft for the payment of money, for the purpose of obtaining from any person, firm, partnership, or corporation, any money, property, or other thing of value or paying for any services, wages, salary, labor, or rent, knowing it will not be paid by the drawee and payment is refused by the drawee, is guilty of issuing a bad check or draft.

(b)For purposes of this Subsection (1), a person who issues a check or draft for which payment is refused by the drawee is presumed to know the check or draft would not be paid if he had no account with the drawee at the time of issue.

(2)Any person who issues or passes a check or draft for the payment of money, for the purpose of obtaining from any person, firm, partnership, or corporation, any money, property, or other thing of value or paying for any services, wages, salary, labor, or rent, payment of which check or draft is legally refused by the drawee, is guilty of issuing a bad check or draft if he fails to make good and actual payment to the payee in the amount of the refused check or draft within 14 days of his receiving actual notice of the check or draft's nonpayment.

(3)An offense of issuing a bad check or draft shall be punished as follows:

(a)If the check or draft or series of checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is less than $500, the offense is a class B misdemeanor.

(b)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $500 but is less than $1,500, the offense is a class A misdemeanor.

(c)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $1,500 but is less than $5,000, the offense is a felony of the third degree.

(d)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $5,000, the offense is a second degree felony.

A third degree felony in UT is punishable by 0-5 years in jail and up to a $5000 fine.  See Utah Code §76-3-203 and §76-3-301

I would verify that the phone number actually belongs to the DA.  If it does do not waste time with DV he needs to make arrangements to get this paid ASAP or he could end up in jail.  

[Cliff2009]

7 minutes ago, Clydesmom said:

This one calls for tough love.  BS.  He had to have known writing a check that large whether the funds were there.  If he is using the bank account he also had to know it was not paid.  He also knows to make arrangements to have his mail forwarded from the PO and not his ex.  How long ago did he write this check?

It is possible it is a collection agency that has contracted to use the DA letter head as it does happen.  HOWEVER, I would not assume it is.  The problem with this situation and DV is if it really is the DA they are not subject to the FDCPA and could simply file a warrant for his arrest as this is a criminal matter.

Is the number in the letter actually to the DA?  If so he should be worried.  This is a third degree felony due to the amount.

76-6-505.  Issuing a bad check or draft -- Presumption. 

(1)

(a)Any person who issues or passes a check or draft for the payment of money, for the purpose of obtaining from any person, firm, partnership, or corporation, any money, property, or other thing of value or paying for any services, wages, salary, labor, or rent, knowing it will not be paid by the drawee and payment is refused by the drawee, is guilty of issuing a bad check or draft.

(b)For purposes of this Subsection (1), a person who issues a check or draft for which payment is refused by the drawee is presumed to know the check or draft would not be paid if he had no account with the drawee at the time of issue.

(2)Any person who issues or passes a check or draft for the payment of money, for the purpose of obtaining from any person, firm, partnership, or corporation, any money, property, or other thing of value or paying for any services, wages, salary, labor, or rent, payment of which check or draft is legally refused by the drawee, is guilty of issuing a bad check or draft if he fails to make good and actual payment to the payee in the amount of the refused check or draft within 14 days of his receiving actual notice of the check or draft's nonpayment.

(3)An offense of issuing a bad check or draft shall be punished as follows:

(a)If the check or draft or series of checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is less than $500, the offense is a class B misdemeanor.

(b)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $500 but is less than $1,500, the offense is a class A misdemeanor.

(c)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $1,500 but is less than $5,000, the offense is a felony of the third degree.

(d)If the check or draft or checks or drafts made or drawn in this state within a period not exceeding six months amounts to a sum that is or exceeds $5,000, the offense is a second degree felony.

A third degree felony in UT is punishable by 0-5 years in jail and up to a $5000 fine.  See Utah Code §76-3-203 and §76-3-301

I would verify that the phone number actually belongs to the DA.  If it does do not waste time with DV he needs to make arrangements to get this paid ASAP or he could end up in jail.  

I think it is actually the DAs office. 

He did assume the funds were there but his Ex emptied the account. The mechanic had said he was going to work with him and hold off on the check but his ex changed the forwarding order and he never received any correspondence (she did the same with his phone). 

I would think they would take payments, obviously people in this position don't have money. 

[Clydesmom]

57 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

He did assume the funds were there but his Ex emptied the account. The mechanic had said he was going to work with him and hold off on the check but his ex changed the forwarding order and he never received any correspondence (she did the same with his phone). 

Unfortunately none of this is a legal valid defense to bouncing the check.  Had he paid it off within 6 months it wouldn't be a problem.  The forwarding order and phone are all on HIM. He knew where the mechanic was. He knew where the shop was.  He knew the check bounced.  The burden was 1000% on him to make good on it and he didn't.  NOTHING prevented him from calling the mechanic himself and taking care of it.  You/he may not like this answer but we are not talking about simply a civil debt anymore.  There are potentially serious felony criminal charges that go with this.

59 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

I would think they would take payments, obviously people in this position don't have money. 

Extremely doubtful on the payments.  The court will not care if he has the money.  They will find him guilty.  He REALLY needs to take care of this before it gets a LOT worse.  Including consulting a lawyer.

[LaneBlane]

Your friend's best option (perhaps his only option) is to borrow the money it's going to take to pay this off immediately.  Even if he needs to sell a few possessions, making some sacrifices is going to be a whole lot better than the alternative.

Like Clydesmom spelled out, you friend is facing a whole lot of hurt...  jail time, a felony record, and potential fines exceeding the amount of the check.  A felony record can haunt someone for a very long time.

[Cliff2009]

37 minutes ago, LaneBlane said:

Your friend's best option (perhaps his only option) is to borrow the money it's going to take to pay this off immediately.  Even if he needs to sell a few possessions, making some sacrifices is going to be a whole lot better than the alternative.

Like Clydesmom spelled out, you friend is facing a whole lot of hurt...  jail time, a felony record, and potential fines exceeding the amount of the check.  A felony record can haunt someone for a very long time.

His goal is to pay it off but he needs a couple months to be in a position to do so. This was from November of 2017, I would think he has a little time as long as he is in talks, correct or no? 

[LaneBlane]

51 minutes ago, Cliff2009 said:

His goal is to pay it off but he needs a couple months to be in a position to do so. This was from November of 2017, I would think he has a little time as long as he is in talks, correct or no? 

It's been five months.  I think your friend's time is up.  If he delays this any further, he's taking the chance of having an arrest warrant issued.  Look at the posts above... Third Degree Felony

[Clydesmom]

1 hour ago, Cliff2009 said:

His goal is to pay it off but he needs a couple months to be in a position to do so. This was from November of 2017, I would think he has a little time as long as he is in talks, correct or no? 

No.  If the DA believes he is merely stalling and won't follow through they may just issue the warrant and arrest him.  They will NOT warn him.  The letter IS the warning.  The ONE chance he has of this working is to hire a good lawyer to negotiate a settlement with the DA and the mechanic.  On his own the DA is not going to take his word.  He/She deals with far too many people who do not follow through on their promises.

Your friend needs to understand this is no longer just a debt issue.  It is now potentially a very serious criminal matter that could have lifetime consequences. Now is NOT the time to mess around trying to delay and stall for time.  It can only be detrimental to him.

 

[BackFromTheDebt]

Has your friend called the DA's office yet?

 

If not, he should do so.

 

There is good news and bad news.  

The good news is, if your friend calls the DA's office, MOST of the time your friend can work out as good a deal directly with the DA as your friend could get with a lawyer.  Notice I said MOST of the time.  SOME of the time, the DA's office is overworked and drops the ball on the case.  That happened to one of my daughters on a traffic ticket -- she was waiting for the DA's office to get back to her, and they never did, so the judge ruled against her in default.  

If your friend works out a deal with the DA, your friend has two choices:  (1) follow through with the deal, or (2) a felony conviction.  The felony conviction is MUCH worse than whatever the DA demands, no matter how unreasonable or unfair your friend thinks the situation is.  This is the real world here.  

The bad news:

If the DA's office drops the ball on this, guess what?  It is your friend who pays the price, not the schlub in the DA's office who dropped the ball.  If your friend can't get a deal with the DA's office right away, your friend needs a lawyer ASAP.  

Other bad news.  As @Clydesmom pointed out, they are not likely to trust your friend very far.  He had a long time to come up with the money and contact the mechanic, and completely dropped the ball.  Meaning, best case scenario might be an offer from the DA's office to pay off every penny by the end of the month or even the end of the week or else go to jail.  They are not likely to accept payment plans.  If they do, the penalty for missing a payment, even a day late, can be jail.  Saying "I could get the money in a couple of months" is the quickest path to the pokey.  

[WhoCares1000]

I have to agree with the others. First off, if this is from the DA's office, then they don't even have to answer a DV (or can answer it with the police and bracelets which connect). This is not a consumer debt anymore but a legal debt.

Your friend needs to come up with the money yesterday. He needs to sell everything he has and then beg or borrow to get the rest ASAP. This has gone on too long and the DA is probably getting to the point where they will arrest him and then it is game over from there. They will not care that his wife emptied the account. They will not care that his mail did not get forwarded. That is too big of a check to ignore.

Not only that but the mechanic could possibly get a mechanics lien put on the title of the car that was repaired and then repo it for the amount of the check. I think they went to the DA because they would rather not go that route.

This is not a simple debt case. Your friend need a lawyer and to get some cash together. He cannot ignore this anymore and I doubt he will be able to buy much more time (especially not a couple of months more).

[fisthardcheese]

This is not a consumer debt. Checks are essentially supposed to be legal tender (kind of) and not credit.  Therefore, there is no DV and no collections.  These go straight to the county prosecutors office.  Now, even though this is very serious, the goal of the prosecutor is to simply collect the money for the business (recovering the money looks more favorable to their reelection than just throwing someone in jail and the business losing out on their money).  The prosecutor WILL work out a payment deal in most cases, but you better make those payments or they will immediately issue a warrant.  If a warrant is issued the costs will skyrocket above the amount of the check and fees. Because now you will need bail and an attorney on top of it.