williams4

Being sued Unifund

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Seems like it should be so simple - paperwork showing order to compel, opening of AAA22K, closing while waiting for MTC, reopening of AAA22K, your paying your share of AAA22K and AAA22K being re-closed due do plaintiff's non-compliance. Does she have anything at all that contradicts those facts?

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1 minute ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

Seems like it should be so simple - paperwork showing order to compel, opening of AAA22K, closing while waiting for MTC, reopening of AAA22K, your paying your share of AAA22K and AAA22K being re-closed due do plaintiff's non-compliance. Does she have anything at all that contradicts those facts?

No.  She just focuses on me using the 3K account in this court ordered case.  And attaches my briefs for the 3K. And says this is not allowed.

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5 minutes ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

Seems like it should be so simple

I don't take anything for granted anymore.  Seems simple that an arbitrator saying he is only authorized to make a decision for account number in this case and says I can only amend a claim if it pertains to AAA3K then grants summary judgement on a 22K account.  So at this point I have no clue.  lol

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This has to take the cake for the oddest case we've ever seen. So the entire dispute is that you are saying AAA_CASE_#1, which you can show you initiated for 3K account, is for the the 3K account and she is saying that AAA_CASE_#1 is for the court ordered arbitration on the 22K account (and that the closed/reopened/closed AAA_CASE_#2 is for the 3K account and has nothing to do with court case)? It still seems like it would take the judge about a minute to clear that up.

EDIT: and the arbiter knew he was dealing only with AAA3K (AAA_CASE_#1) and arbitrarily decided to rule on 22K debt just because he had a spare minute, even though it wasn't part of his assigned case?

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7 minutes ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

This has to take the cake for the oddest case we've ever seen. So the entire dispute is that you are saying AAA_CASE_#1, which you can show you initiated for 3K account, is for the the 3K account and she is saying that AAA_CASE_#1 is for the court ordered arbitration on the 22K account (and that the closed/reopened/closed AAA_CASE_#2 is for the 3K account and has nothing to do with court case)? It still seems like it would take the judge about a minute to clear that up.

Yeah but now we have an arbitrators award for 22k😂 That kind of put a kink in things. Which if aaa doesn’t change the order then I feel like I have a fair chance in court ordering her back to arbitration for the 22k considering what was argued in court and the wording in the arbitrators award. I don’t know though🤷‍♀️  

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This seems ripe for all of our Case Law Geeks, out there. What does the law say about how courts should handle a botched arbitration? Are the 3K and 22K debts from the same original creditor and year? Seems like the entire arbitration (but certainly the award) should be tossed on the simple fact that the contractual basis for the 3K arbitration was the contract for the 3K debt - NOT the contract governing the 22K debt. 

 

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I went back to beginning of thread and think OP nailed it in February: the timeline suggests that Unifund honestly believed they paid on AAA22K, even though it appears someone (probably accounting - on either end) messed up and reversed account numbers. OP is the only one that has consistently caught and pointed this out.

So what is remedy for these two errors? (1) Unifund consistently acted on incorrect information, even though the error was brought to their attention - seems hard to argue "clerical error," as OP did'n't sit on this and then ambush them. (2) Arbiter granted an award in a case he was not empowered to adjudicate.

Would love to book a seat for August 12 hearing!

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

 (1) Unifund consistently acted on incorrect information, even though the error was brought to their attention - seems hard to argue "clerical error," as OP did'n't sit on this and then ambush them. (2) Arbiter granted an award in a case he was not empowered to adjudicate.

 

 

These are two of the key points I am focusing in on to send to case manager in AAA.  1. Email that clearly states AAA3K has never been in court and that I was waiting for my COURT22K MTC to be granted and I am currently waiting for a response from Filing Department on how to pay this filing fee and send in my court order. (way back on March 4 is when this email was) 2. Clearly showing my receipt to AAA for my filing fee/referencing closed case/court order as AAA filing department instructed me to do  3. The letter AAA sent a few days for AAA22K after me filing this saying "This case is a court compelled case"  4. Pointing out how he said he is only authorized to make a decision on this AAA3K case  5. Only letting me amend claim if it pertained to AAA3K  then something along the lines of by doing so it waived my right to a fair arbitration proceeding for my court compelled case and he did not let me assert my claims against the Respondent for AAA22K however he allowed Respondent to get an award for that account.  (also adding that she got to MSJ because she ignored my MTC and continued litigation by submitting interrogatories which showed I objected because I didn't want to waive my right to arbitration, now, I am waived of my right to arbitration because of this   5.  Arbitrator did not have authority to make an award on AAA22K that was in a different AAA case, which was a court compelled case.

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You think she's nuts. And may be right. I still think only hard facts in entire case are (1) Unifund or AAA reversed case numbers and (2) arbiter went off the reservation.

So how much would it cost us to get to Indiana in August? Maybe Fist would share a room.

 

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3 hours ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

You think she's nuts. And may be right. I still think only hard facts in entire case are (1) Unifund or AAA reversed case numbers and (2) arbiter went off the reservation.

So how much would it cost us to get to Indiana in August? Maybe Fist would share a room.

 

Free room at my house. I can set up some air mattresses at my house😂. I know I keep laughing about this, but I am actually pretty annoyed knowing that I have to continue to fight this. I can’t imagine COURT22k would let the summary judgment slide through. Surely the court would at very least order us back to arbitration for the 22k, right? But I am hoping since I have enough evidence that she was clearly lying to court and didn’t comply with AAA on the actual AAA22k order that the court should dismiss with prejudice. 

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11 hours ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

Seems like it should be so simple - paperwork showing order to compel, opening of AAA22K, closing while waiting for MTC, reopening of AAA22K, your paying your share of AAA22K and AAA22K being re-closed due do plaintiff's non-compliance. Does she have anything at all that contradicts those facts?

She does now.  I would absolutely expect her to bring the latest AAA Award for the $22k into the court hearing next month and use it to show she was correct all along and that the Arbitrator sided with and awarded her the $22k.

OP will have to point out the other parts of the Arbitrator's statement which says this was not an actual claim in this case but just randomly tossed in by the Plaintiff and also try to show that she intentionally commingled the cases in AAA which prejudiced and burdened the Defendant AND that AAA made serious errors in allowing this to proceed without Defendant even having a chance to address the 22K claims in AAA at all. 

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2 hours ago, fisthardcheese said:

OP will have to point out the other parts of the Arbitrator's statement which says this was not an actual claim in this case but just randomly tossed in by the Plaintiff and also try to show that she intentionally commingled the cases in AAA which prejudiced and burdened the Defendant AND that AAA made serious errors in allowing this to proceed without Defendant even having a chance to address the 22K claims in AAA at all. 

It "seems" like it would be easy to show the court what she did.  She ignored my MTC in court and proceeded like I never said it, filed interrogatories (which I objected saying I didn't want to waive my right to arbitration), then she didn't show up in court for my MTC so it was rescheduled, and while we were waiting for the rescheduled MTC hearing she filed MSJ saying that a mere general objection is not sufficient to raise a genuine issue of material fact. Then MTC was granted and I can clearly show the AAA case they closed was for the court order.  And it's clear just from the evidence she presented to the court that she was talking about the other AAA case that has nothing to do with the lawsuit AND she even provided documents from the arbitrator about my amended claim can only be for AAA3K.  The way the arbitrators award is stated, he clearly made a decision off of what was presented in court, which are the court documents from her continuing the case as if I didn't even say arbitration.  It just occurred to me too that in the arbitrators award addressing her saying my claim is frivolous the arbitrator said "Given the fact that the filing was not frivolous and that the Respondent has used this arbitration as a vehicle to bring its counterclaim, I find that Claimant has not taken actions which render this arbitration frivolous."

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16 hours ago, williams4 said:

1. Email that clearly states AAA3K has never been in court and that I was waiting for my COURT22K MTC to be granted and I am currently waiting for a response from Filing Department on how to pay this filing fee and send in my court order. (way back on March 4 is when this email was)

Irrelevant.  I would not mention my waiting to pay at all, because you did pay and they opened the case and sent the regular bills and commencement letter to Unifund.  So your delayed payment is moot.  No need to add in all of the extra details and make this more confusing for the person reading this.

16 hours ago, williams4 said:

2. Clearly showing my receipt to AAA for my filing fee/referencing closed case/court order as AAA filing department instructed me to do

Start with this.  Case was filed, consumer fee was paid and MTC was ordered, here is proof.

16 hours ago, williams4 said:

3. The letter AAA sent a few days for AAA22K after me filing this saying "This case is a court compelled case"  4. Pointing out how he said he is only authorized to make a decision on this AAA3K case  5. Only letting me amend claim if it pertained to AAA3K  then something along the lines of by doing so it waived my right to a fair arbitration proceeding for my court compelled case and he did not let me assert my claims against the Respondent for AAA22K however he allowed Respondent to get an award for that account.

All good.

16 hours ago, williams4 said:

(also adding that she got to MSJ because she ignored my MTC and continued litigation by submitting interrogatories which showed I objected because I didn't want to waive my right to arbitration, now, I am waived of my right to arbitration because of this

AAA does not care what happened in a court hearing.  Forget this.

16 hours ago, williams4 said:

5.  Arbitrator did not have authority to make an award on AAA22K that was in a different AAA case, which was a court compelled case.

Huge main point. 

When I sent this email, I would ask that the highest authority at AAA take a look at this issue because it is very serious.  I would also add that I need a quick response and correct on this before it goes to a court hearing in 30 days.

AAA screwed this up big time.  If they do not respond timely or appropriately I would start talking about attorney general complaints and lawsuits filed against AAA.

 

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4 hours ago, williams4 said:

It "seems" like it would be easy to show the court what she did.  She ignored my MTC in court and proceeded like I never said it, filed interrogatories (which I objected saying I didn't want to waive my right to arbitration), then she didn't show up in court for my MTC so it was rescheduled, and while we were waiting for the rescheduled MTC hearing she filed MSJ saying that a mere general objection is not sufficient to raise a genuine issue of material fact. Then MTC was granted and I can clearly show the AAA case they closed was for the court order.  And it's clear just from the evidence she presented to the court that she was talking about the other AAA case that has nothing to do with the lawsuit AND she even provided documents from the arbitrator about my amended claim can only be for AAA3K.  The way the arbitrators award is stated, he clearly made a decision off of what was presented in court, which are the court documents from her continuing the case as if I didn't even say arbitration.  It just occurred to me too that in the arbitrators award addressing her saying my claim is frivolous the arbitrator said "Given the fact that the filing was not frivolous and that the Respondent has used this arbitration as a vehicle to bring its counterclaim, I find that Claimant has not taken actions which render this arbitration frivolous." 

Again, I think you are bogging this down with a ton of irrelevant information.  Keep it concise and simple. Start with the granted MTC and move from there.  Explain what went down in AAA, show that SHE is the one who mixed cases together despite the fact she claimed YOU were doing that in her response to your MTS and also despite the fact that the arbitrator told her she can not mix the cases together. 

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14 minutes ago, fisthardcheese said:

Huge main point. 

When I sent this email, I would ask that the highest authority at AAA take a look at this issue because it is very serious.  I would also add that I need a quick response and correct on this before it goes to a court hearing in 30 days.

AAA screwed this up big time.  If they do not respond timely or appropriately I would start talking about attorney general complaints and lawsuits filed against AAA.

 

I did make this very clear.  I already sent the email to case manager.  If I don't hear anything back by tomorrow morning I will email a follow up doing what you suggested about highest authority take a look.

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10 minutes ago, fisthardcheese said:

Again, I think you are bogging this down with a ton of irrelevant information.  Keep it concise and simple. Start with the granted MTC and move from there.  Explain what went down in AAA, show that SHE is the one who mixed cases together despite the fact she claimed YOU were doing that in her response to your MTS and also despite the fact that the arbitrator told her she can not mix the cases together. 

Sorry, I was thinking out loud with this.  This is if she brings the arbitration award to our court hearing and tries to get that through court.  I certainly was not going to include all this in my opposition. 

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15 minutes ago, williams4 said:

Sorry, I was thinking out loud with this.  This is if she brings the arbitration award to our court hearing and tries to get that through court.  I certainly was not going to include all this in my opposition. 

Hopefully you will have a positive response from AAA before your hearing which, depending on what they say and do, could block her from bringing the award to your hearing.  Hopefully.

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@fisthardcheese For my opposition, I was going to start with that email about "AAA3K has never been in court and I don't have legal documents to send in.  COURT22K is now granted and was waiting for a response to know how to pay my $200 " mainly because in her MTD she goes on and on about how Plaintiff has not commenced litigation on AAA3K account.  I have already included everything from my MTC granted on in my sanctions.  Her argument in her MTD is saying I am the confused one blah blah blah.   I was thinking if I include this email to show she is once again lying because she clearly knew on March 4 that this AAA3K was never in court and that on March 4 the AAA22K hadn't been paid yet she is still arguing that the AAA3K IS for this COURT22K.  Or no? 

Edit: I guess in my head that would shut down the argument that she was confused, ask forgiveness, dismiss my sanctions and go back to arbitration on the COURT22K before she even tries to say that.

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1 minute ago, fisthardcheese said:

Hopefully you will have a positive response from AAA before your hearing which, depending on what they say and do, could block her from bringing the award to your hearing.  Hopefully.

This is what I am hoping.  It seems like since the arbitrator was hesitant anyway about even including it, it seems like the case manager could send it to him and see if he wanted to correct the award? Or is that not how it works?

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Would it be of any help to get a reconfirmation from AAA on exactly which invoice Unifund paid in February? We have been under the assumption that Unifund got their wires crossed and paid the wrong bill, but what it they paid the correct (22K) bill and AAA's accounting department is where the mix up occurred? Doesn't excuse anything but it may explain why Unifund was so adamant that they paid the correct bill.

 

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1 minute ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

Would it be of any help to get a reconfirmation from AAA on exactly which invoice Unifund paid in February? We have been under the assumption that Unifund got their wires crossed and paid the wrong bill, but what it they paid the correct (22K) bill and AAA's accounting department is where the mix up occurred? Doesn't excuse anything but it may explain why Unifund was so adamant that they paid the correct bill.

 

When AAA sent letter for AAA22K saying I paid my filing fee and now Unifund has the obligation to pay theirs, she replied saying I already paid this.  AAA said this payment was applied to AAA3K and this is a separate case.

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I guess I would seek a more direct confirmation that that is what happened. It seems that once the source of the error is starkly illuminated, that is all that should really matter - "there was an error and HERE it is." Everything else is moot.

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45 minutes ago, williams4 said:

AAA said this payment was applied to AAA3K and this is a separate case.

Is there any chance, at all, that AAA corrected this (applied the payment to the correct, 22K, case, as Unifund intended) and you missed it or weren't informed? I mean what was Unfiund's response to that email? 

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3 hours ago, Goody_Ouchless said:

Is there any chance, at all, that AAA corrected this (applied the payment to the correct, 22K, case, as Unifund intended) and you missed it or weren't informed? I mean what was Unfiund's response to that email? 

No. Everything in arbitration is document with a case number, kind of like court.  So when I file a demand it gets docketed into a specific case number.  That case number sticks throughout the entire process.  So when the I filed demand for the 3k it was documented as case number AAA3K. When she paid we got a letter from case manager saying AAA3K has been assigned to case management department.  When the arbitrator got assigned we got a letter saying arbitrator (name) has been assigned to AAA3K. 

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OMG! It all just clicked when I was cutting grass.  I may be overthinking this, as I usually do but I am thinking she sent a message directly to the arbitrator saying something about me using a court order on account COURT22K to argue my AAA3K account. 

1. I thought it was weird that the letter (from the arbitrator) that was attached in case managers email with the award started off saying "This serves as a reminder that there is to be no direct communication with the arbitrator." Which I get because people may tend to try to right away email him arguing about the award.

2. How quickly her story in court changed in her MTD saying I was using this court order to argue something on account 3K which is not allowed.

3. His statement about her saying my claim was frivolous.  In her response she said it was frivolous by attaching all the court documents and saying look, she had all this already.  But now reading this statement in the arbitrators award again has me thinking she did in fact say something to the arbitrator.  "Given the fact that the filing was not frivolous and that the Respondent has used this arbitration as a vehicle to bring its counterclaim, I find that Claimant has not taken actions which render this arbitration frivolous."

4. Which this would definitely explain how he all of a sudden decided to make an award on the 22K.

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