Bill of Sale Florida or Federal CFR

[WhatsUpDoc]

Can anybody point me to a Florida Law or Federal CFR on the requirements on what exactly needs to be on a bill of sale? 

The reason I ask is because the Bill of Sale Porfolio has sent me during my request doesn't show any identifiers whatsoever. Also from what I've read Bill of Sales actually must be Notarized.

Also I maybe a counter suit against them because they sent me a totally different bill that what is shown in the lawsuit. The Bill of Sale is dated July 19 while the Bill itself is Dated July 22. So, how can you have a Bill of Sale on a Bill that thats dated AFTER the Bill of Sale. In the lawsuit paper work I was served with the bill on their is totally different than what was sent to me today by their attorney. Do I have a FDCPA claim/suite?

The Bill of Sale looks cheesy, like some guy on the street made it up. I am thinking of showing an example to the judge of how without any identifiers anybody can make up a simple bill of sale like this. I mean the freaking letterhead is actually a photo copy, no address, nothing on the letter head. Again no identifiers whatsoever!!! From here a Bill of Sale MUST have:

 

• Amount of consideration paid for the transfer of title and date of purchase.
• Name and address of Seller
• Name and address of Buyer
• Specific information about the asset being transfered from the seller to the buyer.
• Guarantee from the seller that the item is free from all claims and offsets.
• Any representations or warranties
• Signature of the seller(s)
• Signature of a notary public.

I can tell you on the Bill of Sale itself there is NO:
 Amount,

address of Seller no Buyer

No Notary Public whatsoever...

[WhatsUpDoc]

Anyone? So nobody knows if there are any LAWS or RULES, FEDERAL or STATE that pertains to Bill of Sale? On automobiles the VIN must be on there so on a Bill of Sale like this its fine not to have the Account Number on the Bill of Sale and legal?

 

Second, If the Statement of Claim has a company's name spelled out a certain way such as PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES, LLC but on Florida's Real System the only company that is LICENSED in Florida to do such business is PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES LLC wouldn't this an excuse to get this thing dismissed? With the comma on the SOC and REAL SYSTEM showing they are licensed without a comma says there is an issue in the name?

 

Also the Bill of Sale shows a Date BEFORE the Charge Off date and I'm pretty sure that is illegal. One cannot sell an account then add charges to that account AFTER its been sold, mainly the original creditor....Am I correct is asking this?

[BV80]

1 hour ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Anyone? So nobody knows if there are any LAWS or RULES, FEDERAL or STATE that pertains to Bill of Sale? On automobiles the VIN must be on there so on a Bill of Sale like this its fine not to have the Account Number on the Bill of Sale and legal?

In all of the JDB court rulings that reference the contents of a bill of sale, none have referred to state or federal laws that require certain information to be included.  

1 hour ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Second, If the Statement of Claim has a company's name spelled out a certain way such as PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES, LLC but on Florida's Real System the only company that is LICENSED in Florida to do such business is PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES LLC wouldn't this an excuse to get this thing dismissed? With the comma on the SOC and REAL SYSTEM showing they are licensed without a comma says there is an issue in the name?

That’s a big stretch.  How do you know the state of FL didn’t make the error?

You could file a motion to dismiss but, in the event the plaintiff opposes, you bear the burden of proving the lawsuit should dismissed because of a missing comma.  Absent proof, the judge is simply going to role his eyes  

Even if it were to be dismissed, it would more than likely be without prejudice, and the plaintiff could refile.  

1 hour ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Also the Bill of Sale shows a Date BEFORE the Charge Off date and I'm pretty sure that is illegal. One cannot sell an account then add charges to that account AFTER its been sold, mainly the original creditor....Am I correct is asking this?

Without seeing documents, it’s difficult to offer an opinion. 

[WhatsUpDoc]

Automobiles Bill of Sales I know for a fact must have a VIN which is an identifier. I will do some more searching in the CFRs to see what I can find.

Also I asked in another topic about Phone Witnessess and it appears that in Florida ALL parties STILL must agree to this per court rules.

I have a background as an LEO and I've worked in the court system so I know a lot more than a lot of people think about the laws.

I am going to present to the Judge CFR that exempts my VA Compensation from any type of judgement like this, and even my SSDI. Yes I am medically retired so no these junk buyers cannot touch my VA Comp, SSDI nor my estate as the estate is all paid for under the VA Compensation. Yes I know the 3 month rule on SSDI but I live month to month and thanks to the VA they are the cause of this mess in the first place believe it or not. Why? Because they refused to do surgery not once, not twice but three times on both my lumbar and cervical spines where disc herniations have caused many issues such as falling and my wife had to quit work in order to stay home and help me. So because of the awful treatment I've received at the VA I have to go outside on my own and pay for all my medical expenses. I never had any issues before, never but whenever my wife had to stop working I had to choose which accounts were a priority to the welfare of my family.

 

As for the Date on the Bill of Sale, the Date it was signed was 19 July 2016 which was the date they "supposedly" sold the account. Then the day after or two days later Synchrony Bank ADDED charge off fees to the account. How can they add fees on an account that was already sold. Last I forgot to mention, during the discovery I received a completely different "final" bill in the mail by the attorney and its totally different as in whats owed and other things than what is shown in the Statement of Claim. Is this even legal? I got back the end up Feb and I am now getting my questions written out and motions ready because I am going to take this as far as I can. I guess I should go ahead and show the Judge that my ONLY incomes are from the VA and SSDI? And show him the CFRs on these exempt from assignment compensations?

[Clydesmom]

On 1/18/2019 at 12:42 PM, WhatsUpDoc said:

Can anybody point me to a Florida Law or Federal CFR on the requirements on what exactly needs to be on a bill of sale? 

What happened to the attorney you consulted about BK in your first thread?  Did he/she not know?

On 1/18/2019 at 12:42 PM, WhatsUpDoc said:

The reason I ask is because the Bill of Sale Porfolio has sent me during my request doesn't show any identifiers whatsoever. Also from what I've read Bill of Sales actually must be Notarized.

The bill of sale never does show identifiers for each specific account.  I don't know what or where you read it but that is not true at all about it needing to be notarized.

On 1/18/2019 at 12:42 PM, WhatsUpDoc said:

From here a Bill of Sale MUST have

The key words in that statement are "FROM  HERE" but if the sale of the accounts did not take place in FL it would not have to comply with FL law.  It does not mean the sale is not valid of your account or that PRA cannot sue.

5 hours ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Second, If the Statement of Claim has a company's name spelled out a certain way such as PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES, LLC but on Florida's Real System the only company that is LICENSED in Florida to do such business is PORTFOLIO RECOVERY ASSOCIATES LLC wouldn't this an excuse to get this thing dismissed?

Not even close. At best it is merely a clerical error which the court would allow them to amend without consequence.  The reality is that it is a COMMA.  Nothing more than a punctuation mark which does not change their business name or who they are one bit.

5 hours ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

With the comma on the SOC and REAL SYSTEM showing they are licensed without a comma says there is an issue in the name?

There is no issue legally.  Now in your imagination you are attempting to snipe hunt for a legal basis to dismiss and it won't be there over a comma.

5 hours ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Also the Bill of Sale shows a Date BEFORE the Charge Off date and I'm pretty sure that is illegal. One cannot sell an account then add charges to that account AFTER its been sold, mainly the original creditor....Am I correct is asking this?

You are correct in asking but I suspect that you are misinterpreting the document.  Without seeing it no one can say for certain there is a basis for your suspicion.

2 minutes ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

Last I forgot to mention, during the discovery I received a completely different "final" bill in the mail by the attorney and its totally different as in whats owed and other things than what is shown in the Statement of Claim. Is this even legal?

If the final sale amount is more than what they are suing for then yes it is legal.  Nothing requires them to sue for for the full amount.

2 minutes ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

I got back the end up Feb and I am now getting my questions written out and motions ready because I am going to take this as far as I can.

Why didn't you just file a motion to compel arbitration like we told you in your first thread?  Keep in mind when you lose the first time and appeal many states require you to post an appeal bond in the amount of the verdict against you.  Can you financially do that?

3 minutes ago, WhatsUpDoc said:

I guess I should go ahead and show the Judge that my ONLY incomes are from the VA and SSDI?

And show him the CFRs on these exempt from assignment compensations?

You don't get it.  The fact that your income is from disability is NOT a legal reason for the court to deny PRA a judgment against you.  It only means they cannot garnish your checks or levy your bank accounts.  The court will not care you are on disability and the Judge may chastise you for living beyond your means and defaulting on the debt.

Again, if you are collection proof why do you even care?

 

[WhatsUpDoc]

I got to court this morning and case was DISMISSED and they cannot refile....I guess everything I asked and my suspicions was not correct?

 

BTW PRA can't never and will never be able to show proof they actually own any of these accounts they bring to court. They never follow the RULES OF CIVIL COURT and on Form 1.932 it reads:

COMPLAINT

Plaintiff, A. B., sues defendant, C. D., and alleges:

 

1. This is an action for damages that (insert jurisdictional amount).
2. Defendant owes plaintiff $………. that is due with interest since …..(date)….., according to the attached account.

 

WHEREFORE plaintiff demands judgment for damages against defendant.

 

NOTE: A copy of the account showing items, time of accrual of each, and amount of each must be attached.

 

If you ever want to win your case or get to the point where the PRA Attorney has to drop the case this is how you do it. Whenever these attorneys for PRA submits to the court a simple "statement" from the creditor and a "robo bill of sale" that is NOT proof they own the account. Also the statement they most of the time use that shows the charge offs MUST ALSO "show items, time of accrual of each, and amount of each MUST be attached". This is where I believe people fail reading these forums. These rules are not something that's a "judgement call" for the judge to decide. The burden is on the Plaintiff not the Defendant and if the Plaintiff cannot produce the documents such as Original Credit Application, ALL statements then they cannot even proceed.
I submitted about 5 motions to the Court, a Production Motion to the Plaintiff and they could not produce the documents. Remember because they say own the account does not mean they legally own the account for certain.

 

Let me give you something about my background, I worked in Law Enforcement for 8 years and worked at a Civil Commitment for Sexual Predators and Offenders here in Florida for 10 years as an Information Systems Specialists. One of my responsibilities was the keep up on the Law Library they have. I was the person who would get the Lexis Nexis CD and had to update the Law Library Server. I use to research a lot of stuff.

I'm a 100% P&T disabled veteran and won all my claims with the VA on my own because I read the laws and bought the main book that shows veterans all the laws pertaining to VA Claims. I'm also retired with SSDI, again won that case on my own without an attorney.

I say this because there are many people in this world that is ignorant of the Federal and State Laws and Cases. This is this is the very first time I've ever been sued for anything. Each time as I went to court I would sit there listening to other Defendants and I felt so bad for them. I felt so bad I wanted to ask them if they needed help because they just did not know anything and don't realize these junk debt buyers are nothing but bullies. Let them sue me, whenever they do, they best be careful because I may start filing counter suits against them if I find one violation of the federal credit protection act and trust me I've found a few violations with this lawsuit that I am now using my think tank if I want to file complaints against PRA....

 

[WhatsUpDoc]

One last thing. I submitted a Motion denying any Phone or video witness and attorney that I HAD coming up today my 2nd lawsuit that PRA is trying to do. The judge APPROVED that motion and the Attorney and any Witnesses they have must show up to court. I am going to hammer that Witness big time if it comes to that. I have some good questions thanks to reading the laws. A few days later I received a SUBSEQUENT Order from the Judge to ALL attorneys, they MUST be PRESENT in Court for ALL pretrials and trials. This judge has had enough of these call ins and said its NOT at the courts discretions to allow "call-ins" and he quoted Florida Rules of Courts. I think these attorneys have hit his last nerve.

 

Well again today I go to court and boom my 2nd dismissal in two months against PRA. Let me explain something to everyone. Do not be scared of bullies because I can promise you what they are doing current will be stopping very soon. Myself and others are advocating to the Federal Legislation that will be stopping the reselling of debt accounts like this and its because of one single reason. Lets says the Original Creditor sold your account to somebody else for cents on the dollar which happens most of the time. No matter if you satisfy that debt or not the Original creditor will still report it as bad to your credit report. This is in fact a clear violation of Fair Credit Consumers Act because if that debt is satisfied the company who bought the should be allowed to take the original creditors report off but under Federal Laws they can't. So my point is why satisfy the debt if its still reported as bad on your credit report? I am now waiting on another Debt Collector to come after me for a Verizon bill. What they do not know is they sent me a so called statement saying I owe them this much but I made a payment to verizon and verizon accepted the payment just last month, after the so called debt was sold. So, I go pay on the account this month and it now shows as paid in full. Trust me I have copied of me paying on the account, the bank statement showing they accepted the payment and a copy showing that it was paid in full with 0 balance. I was beginning to pay on the account again, I just ran into some trouble with the Veteran Affairs saying I owed them money when they were at fault and that was dismissed because they realized it was their fault.

The judge said to me, who BTW is a new judge that was just voted in this past elections, he says "Sir you may become somewhat a legend here in ^^^ County." I asked why your honor. He said because you won two of your cases in the past two months. I said "Well my mother in law just said to me yesterday I should become and attorney." And then I began to walk about after receiving the dismissal order. As I was at the door the judge brought me back and said to me "I had a friend who was 68 when she received her law degree so its never too late." I told the judge I will think about it because I just do not know. I can tell everyone, there is noway I can be attorney because my conscious forbids of doing what many of these attorneys are doing to people, the poor. Again, I do not think its right under Federal Laws for these companies to by up debt, you pay that debt but the original creditor still shows it as bad on your report. I am now thinking of sueing PRA or filing  complaint against them with the Feds........I am sick of seeing people get railroaded because of greed. Some people have legitimate issues where something happens where they cannot pay the debt, mainly after they had an account with that company for 5+ years, never late whatsoever....

 

BTW I'm 50 years old, I live in pain, taken myself off of pain killers because I was in pain while on pain killers and told myself what is the use of taking them if I was in pain. I took them for 5 years and over night I quit and only had one night of withdraws. I am one lucky person. My conscious is clear and if I were to die I would be home with my creator...

[nobk4me]

Maybe you should become a lawyer.  Not all lawyers are bottom feeders representing JDBs.  You could be one of the good guys helping the poor: public defender, legal aid, or a consumer lawyer taking FDCPA cases.